bonduca

Why wouldn't I abandon this God? And why wouldn't I have hope, now that the world is a real place, and I no longer beg for the whimsical favors of the invisible sky daddy?

I don't believe in Santa, either, but I still enjoy my Christmas presents.

[ July 16, 2002: Message edited by: bonduca ]</p>

luvluv

That's a pointless derisive strawman. I hope you don't think that my beliefs constitute a "sky-daddy". Is it necessary to be insulting?

At any rate, you haven't answered the question. What is the logical basis for hope.

John Page

Because hope worked last time. Of course, one can always have a false hope.

luvluv

God worked for me last time. Should I believe in God?

luvluv

That is because there are presents to enjoy.

Is there hope? How do we know?

Eudaimonist

The logical basis for hope is that rational beings can solve problems. Hope need not require belief in the necessity of a positive future outcome -- merely the possibility of a positive future outcome if rational people put their minds and effort into creating such an outcome.

daemon

Correct, no.
Hope begets better results than despondency.
Hope makes sense. God doesn't. Sorry.

tronvillain

luvluv:
The logical basis for hope is the possibility that what we hope for will occur - even even if the odds are a hundred to one or a thousand to one against, one may have hope that the one will come up. You see, hope is not the belief that something will occur, it is optimism based upon its mere possibility.

bonduca

"Sky-daddy" is MY name for this deity, based on MY life experience, and has nothing whatsoever to do with you.

Please explain what sort of hope you refer to, and why you apparently think one can only have this hope by embracing what is essentially a lie.

Edited to add that I will simply plagerize Eudaimonist, since he has expressed my thoughts on this exactly.

[ July 16, 2002: Message edited by: bonduca ]</p>

daemon

Really? Have any proof it wasn't mere hope?