Jobar

GeoTheo... we are not angry at God. We do not believe God exists. We know you have trouble conceiving of that, and we have been rather extraordinarily patient with you while attempting to make it clear.

If I chose to, I could go back and find far more hateful and insulting comments in your posts, than you have been subjected to on these boards. (Of course I am not saying you have not ever been personally insulted; you have. I am saying, though, that the huge majority of those insults you brought on yourself.)

I do not think that any of the posters on this thread have been anything but up front with you; some of the responses I would even say were kind. None of them appear ill meant.

If you want, see what the responses to your crisis of faith are on any of the Christian boards. Or perhaps consult with some of our theistic members via PM; Rev. Joshua or seebs may have advice for you. However, if you continue to express the bitterness and thoughtlessness you are showing to the atheists who post here (and in fact are the originators and the backbone of Internet Infidels) I may well feel required, as a moderator in charge of keeping these discussions civil, to take action against you. I have done so in the past; I hope I will not have to in the future. Jobar.

Synaesthesia

Although I'd have to agree, I should point out that there is a method for avoiding acrimony that is overwhelmingly successful with all but the most dedicated troll: Do unto others.

Yes, it is difficult, takes conscious effort and often involves not using that absolutely deadly counter-insult, but it works every time if applied consistently.

That being said, I agree that in a time of emotional trouble, books are a relaxing and enjoyable alternative to message boards.
(Hopefully BB's are never alternatives to books )

GeoTheo

Jobar,
I'm not whining about people insulting me. I could care less. If you ever took action against me I don't remember it. Here is my point in a nut shell:
Overkill. you guys way overstate your case against Christianity to the point that you lose credibility. I know noone wants to hear it and I am leaving here shortly. I agree I have not much to add. I am not going to just harangue everybody. Here is why I got frustrated: I have serious doubts about Christianity I don't think it is the root of all evil as it is presented here. I know it is not. Atheism is a big turn off to me because of that. There are some intelligent thoughtfull ones here but I am finding for the most part they have not much to say. So I am just burnt out. The overall tone here is just a big scoff at Christianity. A big sarcastic sophmoric scoff at Christianity. It has gotten old. I don't really see anybody wrestling with the big issues. I was hoping to gain some perspectives on how atheists deal with the big issues in life. I went off on this thread because of the overall tone. No one gives a crap about the question being asked. It is meant to be a big "gotcha!" The original poster doesn't care about the meaning of the substitutionary atonement and none of the following posters do. Obviously Kenny does.
Atheists don't seem to have anything to offer. They have no answeres they define themselves by what they don't believe in. Think about that for a second. That can only lead to negativity. Politically, there is some disagreement over things but mainly you all are democrats. You have nothing new to say in that arena. Then you guys are the first to say atheism is not a world view and that it doesn't have anything to offer. So that's my point. It's like negative space. Negativity burns you out. By not having a position on anything you can attack everything and have nothing to lose. But you also have nothing to offer. So thats why I'm burn't out. I will leave and read some books. I am thinking of reading Karl Barth and Kierkagard, and then perhaps some Taoism. I might even check out some Roman Catholicism, I guess that would be Thomas Aquinas.
I think this board has potential and at one time I enjoyed it here. Christian message boards generally suck. I did like it here once because the moderators take a hands off approach and you can somtimes have interesting discussions. Also, Christians tend to like to cut and paste alot and that gets old.But the same theme of how western Christian culture is the root of all evil has worn me out. But, hey you Guys obviously have boundless enthusiasm for playing that tune endlessly and its your board. So the best thing for me to do is bow out. I probably shouldn't have bothered opening my mouth about how you Guys look. No one cares anyway.
If I could find a board with the level of intellect displayed here, but with a broader range of viewpoints I think it would be perfect.
Take care.

GeoTheo

Kenny,
I will take your advice.
God Bless
Theo

Jobar

GeoTheo, you think this board is about nothing but kicking dirt on Christians?

Try going to one of our forums and just lurk a bit. Don't post; simply, your own tight focus on Christianity and the opposition we express concerning it is distorting your vision. Pick a random sample of threads and read them. Don't concentrate on EoG or RRPetc. or even E/C; read some of the social forums, and SL&S, and Philosophy. *You are seeing only the opposition you are seeking.* This forum offers a wonderfully wide range of topics; would that I had more time to take part in more of them outside this room!

Look, burnout affects us all sometimes, theist and atheist alike. Take a break. Do something else, and come back if and when you are ready.

I can pretty much promise that Internet Infidels will still be here.

Brian63

Since we're opening up here...

I have been an atheist for pretty much all my life, and the only Christians that I've ever encountered during the vast majority of that time were, to put it bluntly, rather dumb. It gave me the impression that Christianity necessarily dumbs down a person and that there was no room for Christianity (or religious beliefs in general) among serious intellectuals. That is, once a person understands the world, philosophy, and various other religions, they would immediately see how naive they were to believe in Christianity.

Coming to this website actually helped break up that negative stereotype. I was inspired to start reading Christian apologetics, and found out that a lot of these Christian authors were serious philosophy students. This ran contrary to everything I had ever personally observed.

The downside from reading books by Christian apologists though is that I cannot see how they would respond to non-Christian criticisms of their works. There is no visible feedback forum used by those Christians when I read rebuttals to their books on this website (in the library). That is why having Christians continue to stay here and debate the issues on this message board is so helpful to all of us, theists and atheists alike.

I have learned an incredible amount from good folks such as Kenny (I think he was the first very intelligent Christian that I have ever encountered, but I have seen many more since then). A lot of atheists have made remarks that I would otherwise have thought were sound arguments, but then I would see some Christian on this board point out the error in their reasoning. I am extremely thankful for those Christians that have done so.

When I lurk and read over at the Baptistboard, I see them getting away with saying lots of plainly wrong things and there is nobody there that is willing to question it. We need voices of dissent here on this board to help prevent such errors being propogated.

So, I applaud the Christians that come here and put up with us jerks. Lord knows I wouldn't if I was them.

Brian

Biff the unclean

Odd though. On Christian boards I've never seen an Atheist last long enough to tire of the debate. They have always, in my experience, been removed.
Frankly I find Theism rather tedious and extremely negative--and more than a little dangerous. I know Geo just called Atheism negative because it doesn't reinforce his opinions. But the reason I find Theism negative is that when presented with reality Theists give out a resounding "No," and then proceed to spin a fantasy. To shut your eyes to the wonders of the universe and the pleasures of life is IMO about as negative as one can get.

Brian63

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Well, actually...there were several atheists here that used to post at the Baptistboard, and left at various points (unrelated to the "purging") because they grew tired of arguing with them. It's not an uncommon thing to do, for theists or atheists.

Quote:

I know Geo just called Atheism negative because it doesn't reinforce his opinions.

I admit to having mostly skimmed through this thread, but I do not recall GeoTheo saying anything like that. It sounds like you are reading things into his words that he clearly did not intend. Can you point out exactly where he used those exact words that you did?

Of course, there are those theists that believe in God not because they ignore reality but because they think the reality is that God exists. That's a nice, comfortable (and false) stereotype you've set up for yourself though, I imagine.

Brian

GeoTheo

Brian,
For some reason Christian message boards are dumb.
I will agree on that. The moderators are haevy handed, the posters arguments are often weak and the over all intellectual level is low. I can't take them. An example of a debate on a Christian message board is as follows: Some person will present a theological doctrine for debate. Then someone will post that that view is heretical but give no reason. Then someone will post, like a foot and a half of Bible quotes and no explanation for them. Then there will be some banter back and forth. Three or four people will object to the fact that people are debating and that we should all just love each other, then the moderator will close the thread. Plus they like to ban people.
It's totally assinine. But I will say this, many people go to them just for fellowship and don't really like to debate about things. Often the forums aren't set up for debate. So in a sense I shouldn't blame them for not liking to debate about things. But, I'm not a really touchy feely person so I tend to end up debating things.
I enjoyed Bible college a lot more than I enjoyed Church because critical thinking was really encouraged. At least in my particular college. Of course it was in the North East. I have not been able find another environment like it. People were always throwing around different philosophical and theological questions.

Biff the unclean

I know Geo just called Atheism negative because it doesn't reinforce his opinions.
-----------------
I admit to having mostly skimmed through this thread, but I do not recall GeoTheo saying anything like that. It sounds like you are reading things into his words that he clearly did not intend. Can you point out exactly where he used those exact words that you did?

Okay. It comes from context.
But I really don't see how people can deny the existence of God for long. I know there are all sorts of things people rationalize away in their lives.
and
Atheists don't seem to have anything to offer. They have no answeres they define themselves by what they don't believe in. Think about that for a second. That can only lead to negativity.
Read his posts in other threads and you'll find that he is also having social trouble with what he calls "nominal Christians" (which is his term for main stream Christians) and their lack of acceptance of his behavior. He credits this rejection to their feeling the weight of their own sins which they notice all the more in comparison to his Christian life style
Of course, there are those theists that believe in God not because they ignore reality but because they think the reality is that God exists.
The substitution of a fantasy for reality is not the creation of a new reality.
That's a nice, comfortable (and false) stereotype you've set up for yourself though, I imagine.
As I clearly stated -- I was stating my own opinion.
It is not comfortable, a stereotype, nor is it false.