Duvenoy

I must join the choir that sings, "Don't Fuck With This Guy." If he's anything like Kent, he's damned good at what he does and he'll rough you up pretty badly. Questioning him from the audence is exactly what he wants. It gives him yet another chance to impress the faithful. True, it'll all be nonsense, but who's to debunk it when it comes at you like a runaway train?

I would suggest simply sitting quietly and taking notes; lots of notes. Then write and at least attempt to publish an article in the local paper.

doov

Duvenoy

I have read of some success in passing out literature, but I doubt if it's really all that effective. The problem is that Eric H. will be preaching mainly to the choir. Most, perhaps as many as 90%, in the audence will be believers. The pamphlets will be circular filed, if accepted at all. And handing them out just might get you evicted from the premisis. Except for Genesis, YECs hate the printed word. It can't be shouted down.

doov

Non-praying Mantis

ex-xian,

I in Virginia, too, and only two hour from the city.

Yeah, do you have any more particulars about when and where?

NPM

tgamble

Sure. But only to take quotes out of contxt.

tgamble

The only real way to deal with this kind of quack is to expose the lies in a way that is completely undisputable.

For example, Kent claimed that a mammoth was dated and the results gave three different dates for three different parts. He referenced a paper to support this claim.

If you could get a copy of this paper and ask him to point out the parts that supports his claims, that would quickly expose him. He would, obviously, be unable to do so. That should get any thinking person to have serious doubts.

Of course, if there are thinking people in the audience, they probably wouldn't take Hovind seriously in the first place.

Since it's Eric, not Kent, it might take something else. But Eric probably does the same seminars as his father so he might make the same claim. I doubt Kent encourages origonal thought in his children..... :boohoo: :banghead:

"KH: One part of a mammoth was carbon-dated at 29,000 years old. Another part is 44,000 years old. Here's two parts of the same animal. That's from USGS Professional Paper #862.

Hovind makes a big-time misrepresentation here. I looked at the data in USGS Professional Paper 862. It is a 1975 paper by Troy Pewe entitled "Quaternary Stratigraphic Nomenclature in Unglaciated Central Alaska". It is a description of stratigraphic units in Alaska, but does contain more than 150 radiocarbon dates. Many of these dates are from the 1950's and 60's. There are three references to mammoths: hair from a mammoth skull (found by Geist in 1951 in frozen silt); "flesh from lower leg, Mammuthus primigenius" (found by Osborne in 1940, 26 m below the surface); and the "skin and flesh of Mammuthus primigenius [baby mammoth] (found by Geist in 1948 "with a beaver dam"). The dates given are, respectively, 32,700; 15,380; and 21,300 years BP BUT the last is thought to be an invalid date because the hide was soaked in glycerin.

NOWHERE IN THE PAPER DOES IT SAY, OR EVEN IMPLY, THAT THESE SPECIMENS ARE PARTS OF THE SAME ANIMAL. They were found in different places, at different times, by different people. One is even termed "baby", and the other is not. To construct this Fractured Fairy Tale, Hovind must have hoped that no one listening would check and see what his reference really said.

KH: One part of Dima, the frozen mammoth, the baby one that was emaciated, was 40,000 years old. Another part was 26,000, and the wood around the carcass was dated at 9000 years old. I mean, in spite of all the hoopla, carbon dating just simply doesn't work.

The only dates I have found for "Dima" are close to 40,000 years BP: "The field evidence and radiocarbon analysis indicate that the baby mammoth, who was named Dima, was buried in a bog or small lake by a mudslide 44,000 years ago" (Newell, p. 66) and "...Dima was dated at 41,000 + 900 BP" http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/mom/atlantis.html. Since Hovind completely misrepresented the Alaskan mammoth data above, it is not unreasonable to assume that his information about "Dima" is also incorrect."

http://home.austarnet.com.au/stear/h...airy_tales.htm

Albion

One thing you could do is make notes of some of the more obvious lies (and there are bound to be obvious lies) in this presentation, and other people could do so in subsequent debates, just so there's a record of them. If he ever gets into a debate with an experienced scientific debater, information like that might be quite useful. Then if he carries on with the same nonsense after that, there'll be records of his antics.

caravelair

is there any way i could find out if such an event is taking place in my hometown at any time? i'd love to expose the deception of a creationist in front of a large audience. he he.

ex-xian

Sure, it's in Kingsport, just of John B Dennis Hwy, if you're familiar with the city. The dates are 4/27 - 4/29. I haven't called the contact number to confirm that it's all still on, but I assume that it is since it's still on his website. I didn't know one could travel from Roanoke to the Tri-cities in 2 hours..you must drive faster than me.

Sure, here's a link to the Hovinds' itinerary at www.dino.com. It says that Hovind will be in Buffalo in Septmeber. If you haven't already, take the opportunity to read thru the rest of "Dr. Dino's" website, especially the FAQ's and the articles. Depending on your temperment, you'll either get a good laugh or your blood pressure will start to rise. Make sure you take a look at his photos of "modern day dinos."

---------------------------

From the rest of the posts here, maybe I won't be really confrontational at all if I get the chance to ask questions--seeing a nonbeliever who is calm and polite might blow their minds considering the stereotypes that Hovind and his like foster.. I espcially like the ideas about taking notes for the future and for the local paper, and asking about the tax evasion. The entire ministry is tangled up in that, so it would be a good question to ask junior.

caravelair

hey, thanks! i think i will definately try and make it out to his buffalo appearance. that gives me several months to prepare. not that i'd need that long, but i do need several months to sit on my ass and be lazy before i start preparing.

i couldn't find the "modern day dinos" though. where are they on the site? sounds extremely amusing. he he.

ex-xian

Oops! The link should be www.drdino.com, not dino.com. Anyway

MODERN DAY DINOS HERE!!!

Here's a sample