Jat

It has been shown that the death penalty has never been an effective deterent since the majority of murders are crimes of passion, or of the moment. Plus, it is not a punishment either. One is suppose to learn from being punished. You learn nothing once you're dead. So, it can't be a true punishment.

Optional

Again, it's not supposed to be a punishment. It's not supposed to deter anybody from anything. It's supposed to be removing a danger to society.

-me

Jat

Than why not execute all perceived dangers to society? All violent criminals are a threat to society. It sure would clean out your prisons and then you'll have more room to put pot smokers in there.

The death penalty in the USA is prejudice towards those of color. If you're a non-white you're more likely to get it than a white person is for the same crime, especially in Texas.

Dr Rick

All have sinned, the Bible tells us; there is no "innocent life"

NHGH

A few of my off-hand reactions on this topic:

You can put me down as another vote in the "condemned man's choice" camp. To me, this seems like the most reasonable way of handling the fundamental problem that I think the death penalty poses: How much power should we place in the hands of the state? Let convicted murderers choose whatever seems to them the lesser of two evils: death or imprisonment.

I actually don't think that's true. Obviously, you couldn't give more time (in any meaningful sense) to someone who's serving a life sentence already, but the conditions of confinement could get a lot worse. Instead of execution, you could send that person to one of the new "supermax" prisons where prisoners are kept in 23-hours-a-day (or more) confinement, in cellblocks where the doors are operated by remote control so that they are deprived, for the most part, of human contact even with prison staff, etc. All of which makes it very difficult to commit violent acts against other prisoners or staff, and probably much more unpleasant than confinement in a "normal" maximum-security prison. Very harsh, and again I'd allow the condemned prisoner the option of execution, but the alternative is there.

Is it that they actually want to die, or just that they choose it as the lesser of two evils? No doubt there are a few isolated cases of people using execution as a sort of state-assisted suicide, but I'm not convinced that this is frequent enough to set up public policy around these exceptions.

Frankly, I get a little antsy when people object to the death penalty on the grounds that it's not severe enough. I'm already uncomfortable enough with allowing the state to execute people; I'm definitely opposed to allowing it to inflict a fate worse than death.

Dr Rick

"In reality, executions are seen as the appropriate punishment for certain criminals committing specific crimes. So says the U.S. Supreme Court and so say most death penalty supporters ('advocates')." Death Penalty Paper, from Prodeathpenalty.com

"To fight and deter crime effectively, individuals must have every tool government can afford them, including the death penalty." George E. Pataki, Governor of New York State, 1997,
"Death Penalty is a Deterrent"

NHGH

I think the American justice system is prejudiced against those of color generally, not just in capital cases. That seems to me like more of an argument for taking steps to correct racism in the justice system than an argument against the death penalty in particular.

yguy

It seems self-evident to me that one who would deny the right to life of another person hardly deserves to retain that right for himself.

Optional

Once again, I'm not talking about a perceived danger to society, I'm talking about an individual who, through his actions, has proven beyond a reasonable doubt that if he is ever again loose in society, he will kill again. It would be an EXTREMELY strict standard.

Oh, and for the record, I think we should let the pot smokers out now.

I agree. That's part of why I don't like the way the death penalty is currently applied.

-me

Optional

Yes, I realize that many death penalty supporters think that way, but not me. In my conversation with Jat I am speaking strictly about what my ideal solution would be.

-me