Freethought & Rationalism Archive

RufusAtticus · 10-07-2002, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sciteach:
Yes, I agree, that for ID'ers to be taken seriously they have to produce good science using ID as a starting premise,lets see some good predictive data. Your appeals to the scientific method minus the god quotient are quite ironic considering that Francis Bacon was quite a bible believing christian. What is your response to the idea that science is an endaevor that was started by christians: Galileo, Copernicus, Newton, Harvey, Linnaeus, Boyle, Pasteur--all are at least deists and mostwere believers in scripture and saw science as a way to "think the thoughts of God after Him"

I think it is funny how you admit that IDists are trying to impose their Christianity on science, a claim which DI tries to deny.

This is not about Christians versus scientists --or even religion versus science--because some of the most vocal opponents of ID are devout Christians. (Take Ken Miller for example.)

It is about faith-based pseudoscience versus science.

Feather · 10-07-2002, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RufusAtticus:
Doesn't Texas Tech have more than one biology prof? Sounds like the kid is a whiner. If he wan't to be a creationist in med school, he can apply to Loma Linda.

I wonder if anyone would care if the student expressed that he didn't believe that germs cause disease. I can see it now:

Professor rigid on the cause of disease

(....)

Well that just made my day. <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Dr Rick · 10-07-2002, 12:20 PM

Asking a biology professor to ignore a student's rejection of evolution is akin to asking an astronomy teacher to dismiss a pupil's rejection of galaxies.

Rick

RufusAtticus · 10-07-2002, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Feather:


Well that just made my day. <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Thanx Feather.

Pseudonymph · 10-07-2002, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rbochnermd:
Asking a biology professor to ignore a student's rejection of evolution is akin to asking an astronomy teacher to dismiss a pupil's rejection of galaxies.

Rick

Who do you claim is resorting to rhetoric and mud-slinging?

In absolutely no way is your "analogy" pertinent or useful to this discussion.

Please don't hijack another thread with inane one-liners and drivel.

RufusAtticus · 10-07-2002, 01:23 PM

SirenSpeak,

The analogy was spot on. Perhaps your anger over it should tell you something.

The only controvercy over evolution is that there is no controvercy.

Pseudonymph · 10-07-2002, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RufusAtticus:
SirenSpeak,

The analogy was spot on. Perhaps your anger over it should tell you something.

The only controvercy over evolution is that there is no controvercy.

Rufus...my anger comes only from his lack of communication skills that I encountered in a previous thread.

His analogy is flawed because it has literally nothing to do with the topic at hand. No one seriously disputes "galaxies" for for crying out loud. It doesnt relate to this discussion.

You seem to speak to me as though I deny evolution. Not even close. I just hate it when we shoot ourselves in the foot with problems such as these.

Albion · 10-07-2002, 01:32 PM

Quote:

What is your response to the idea that science is an endaevor that was started by christians: Galileo, Copernicus, Newton, Harvey, Linnaeus, Boyle, Pasteur--all are at least deists and mostwere believers in scripture and saw science as a way to "think the thoughts of God after Him"

A lot of scientists today are bible-believing Christians who are doing science because they want to find out about God's creation and how it works. The difference between them and the IDists is that the Bible-believing scientists are content to use the scientific method as it presently stands in their attempt to study God's creation and the IDists aren't.

Do you think that Christians who use the scientific method without the need to insert an intelligent designer are in some way lesser Christians than the likes of Phillip Johnson and michael Behe?

Coragyps · 10-07-2002, 01:34 PM

I just reread the newspaper article, and I think we may be missing an important datum for this whole discussion. The article says the student "encountered" Dini's policy. Nowhere does it say that he was enrolled in his class. I truly suspect that some witch hunting is going on, and that the hunters have decided that Dr Dini is made of wood.

Dr Rick · 10-07-2002, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Albion:
A lot of scientists today are bible-believing Christians who are doing science because they want to find out about God's creation and how it works. The difference between them and the IDists is that the Bible-believing scientists are content to use the scientific method as it presently stands in their attempt to study God's creation and the IDists aren't.

Science is not a method to study supernatural influences such as god's creation; creationists, ID'ers, Hindus, pagans, and other spiritualists can perform scientific inquiry only by suspending their supernatural beliefs as they make naturalistic inquiries.

A person that draws a conclusion that a material outcome is the result of supernatural intervention is not acting as a scientist.

Rick

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10-07-2002, 12:20 PM	#53
Dr Rick Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: USA Posts: 5,393	Asking a biology professor to ignore a student's rejection of evolution is akin to asking an astronomy teacher to dismiss a pupil's rejection of galaxies. Rick

10-07-2002, 01:23 PM	#56
RufusAtticus Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NCSU Posts: 5,853	SirenSpeak, The analogy was spot on. Perhaps your anger over it should tell you something. The only controvercy over evolution is that there is no controvercy.

10-07-2002, 01:34 PM	#59
Coragyps Veteran Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Snyder,Texas,USA Posts: 4,411	I just reread the newspaper article, and I think we may be missing an important datum for this whole discussion. The article says the student "encountered" Dini's policy. Nowhere does it say that he was enrolled in his class. I truly suspect that some witch hunting is going on, and that the hunters have decided that Dr Dini is made of wood.

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