Freethought & Rationalism Archive

LittleGuy · 10-09-2002, 01:52 AM

DAMMMIT!!!!!

Why is it that EVERY argument/vent/rant against vegetarians/vegans include DISSING TOFU!!?!?!?!?!?!

It makes me mad!

Oh..
And I don't get why in Australia they're promoting lamb so much.
Tastes stinky and oily. Induces puking.
Yuk.

Hayden · 10-09-2002, 01:54 AM

Homer: But what about the animal that makes pork, and the animal that makes bacon, and the animal that makes ham...

Lisa: But Dad, pork, bacon and ham come from the same animal!

Homer: Sure Lisa, some magical animal...

(Paraphrased 'cause I saw it years ago)

HR

Hayden · 10-09-2002, 02:00 AM

Serious post:

As Denis Leary puts it: "not eating meat is a choice, eating meat is an instinct."

I think there's a lot of truth to that. A baby will instinctively gnaw at a lamb chop, and like it. Our digestive systems are not suited to a pure vegetarian diet, IIRC, i.e. our lower intestines are too short.

As far as veganism goes, I'm an avid (cow's) milk drinker, and credit that for the fact that in 26 years of contact sports and eating junk food, I've never broken a bone or had a dental cavity. I don't know any vegetarians, let alone vegans, who can lead a healthy lifestyle without some sort of dietary supplement (of course, I don't know that many full stop).

Anyway, my $0.02 (worth about $0.01 US

)

HR

Lord Asriel · 10-09-2002, 02:01 AM

Maybe my mum was cooking it wrong when I was growing up, but I never developed a taste for meat so giving it up was no great biggie for me.

Of course there are some vegans and vegetarians who adopt an arsehole fundy position about their beliefs, but there are plenty who don't.

Ethical considerations aside, a vegetarian diet is much better for you. We didn't evolve to eat meat every day. It's only the development of factory farming methods that have brought the price of meat down so much that we can do that.

That's my 2 pennies worth.

Hayden · 10-09-2002, 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord Asriel:
Maybe my mum was cooking it wrong when I was growing up, but I never developed a taste for meat so giving it up was no great biggie for me.

I wouldn't be surprised: my friend(flatmate for a period)'s parents were from Liverpool, and it took us about two years to stop him boiling meat for us. Very disconcerting.

HR

[ October 09, 2002: Message edited by: Hayden ]

seanie · 10-09-2002, 02:11 AM

This is going back 10 or 12 years but I remember reports of a British vegan society conference.

Apparently there was a split in the movement with a fundamentalist wing attacking the backsliders for impurity.

The argument was about using petrol.

A minority felt very strongly that the lives of all those microscopic marine organisms that died millions of years ago shouldn't be exploited.

Apparently it descended into a fist fight and the Police were called to seperate them.

Now I don't know how accurate the reports were but it still gives me a chuckle.

Hayden · 10-09-2002, 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by seanie:
The argument was about using petrol.

A minority felt very strongly that the lives of all those microscopic marine organisms that died millions of years ago shouldn't be exploited.

Surely you jest!

If this is true, I hope the people complaining didn't use any plastic products, many of which are manufactured using hydrocarbons! This would also rule out nylon, polyester, etc. Of course, wool's already out of the question...

HR

seanie · 10-09-2002, 02:20 AM

I did read it in a paper.

However, given the British press, that's not a testament to accuracy.

Lord Asriel · 10-09-2002, 02:26 AM

I can believe that some people would hold a view like that. I personally hold with reducing use of oil and petro-chemical products, but for environmental reasons, not fossil rights reasons.

I can believe that the conservative press would freely exaggerate the story as well.

Incidentally, while I should have been working, I dug out <a href="http://www.earthsave.bc.ca/materials/articles/articles/health/comparative.html" target="_blank">this article</a>. It supports my case, but not being scientifically trained, I'd appreciate opinions on it.

Hayden · 10-09-2002, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord Asriel:
Incidentally, while I should have been working, I dug out <a href="http://www.earthsave.bc.ca/materials/articles/articles/health/comparative.html" target="_blank">this article</a>. It supports my case, but not being scientifically trained, I'd appreciate opinions on it.

Interesting. I'm not trained in this field either, so I can't really comment, apart from anecdotal comments above and to ask why, if we're not suited to eating meat, some of us seem to have an instinctive appetite for it, and it clearly features in our history.

As far as the teeth/nails thing goes, we've been tool users for a number of years, probably before developing into what we would consider human beings, so we could have done without the typical teeth/nails.

Anyway, my dinner of mussels, chilli, garlic and butter, followed by two smallish Porterhouse steaks with barbecued mushrooms in soy sauce, over potato and kumera (sweet potato) mash, not to mention a few pints, has made me sleepy. Therefore, good night.

HR

PS I'm sorry, but I still get Gargamel flashbacks whenever I read your name! Mrrrrrow!

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10-09-2002, 01:52 AM	#11
LittleGuy Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Sydney,Australia Posts: 280	DAMMMIT!!!!! Why is it that EVERY argument/vent/rant against vegetarians/vegans include DISSING TOFU!!?!?!?!?!?! It makes me mad! Oh.. And I don't get why in Australia they're promoting lamb so much. Tastes stinky and oily. Induces puking. Yuk.

10-09-2002, 01:54 AM	#12
Hayden Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 712	Homer: But what about the animal that makes pork, and the animal that makes bacon, and the animal that makes ham... Lisa: But Dad, pork, bacon and ham come from the same animal! Homer: Sure Lisa, some magical animal... (Paraphrased 'cause I saw it years ago) HR

10-09-2002, 02:00 AM	#13
Hayden Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 712	Serious post: As Denis Leary puts it: "not eating meat is a choice, eating meat is an instinct." I think there's a lot of truth to that. A baby will instinctively gnaw at a lamb chop, and like it. Our digestive systems are not suited to a pure vegetarian diet, IIRC, i.e. our lower intestines are too short. As far as veganism goes, I'm an avid (cow's) milk drinker, and credit that for the fact that in 26 years of contact sports and eating junk food, I've never broken a bone or had a dental cavity. I don't know any vegetarians, let alone vegans, who can lead a healthy lifestyle without some sort of dietary supplement (of course, I don't know that many full stop). Anyway, my $0.02 (worth about $0.01 US ) HR

10-09-2002, 02:01 AM	#14
Lord Asriel Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Essex, UK Posts: 467	Maybe my mum was cooking it wrong when I was growing up, but I never developed a taste for meat so giving it up was no great biggie for me. Of course there are some vegans and vegetarians who adopt an arsehole fundy position about their beliefs, but there are plenty who don't. Ethical considerations aside, a vegetarian diet is much better for you. We didn't evolve to eat meat every day. It's only the development of factory farming methods that have brought the price of meat down so much that we can do that. That's my 2 pennies worth.

10-09-2002, 02:11 AM	#16
seanie Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Edinburgh. Scotland Posts: 2,532	This is going back 10 or 12 years but I remember reports of a British vegan society conference. Apparently there was a split in the movement with a fundamentalist wing attacking the backsliders for impurity. The argument was about using petrol. A minority felt very strongly that the lives of all those microscopic marine organisms that died millions of years ago shouldn't be exploited. Apparently it descended into a fist fight and the Police were called to seperate them. Now I don't know how accurate the reports were but it still gives me a chuckle.

10-09-2002, 02:20 AM	#18
seanie Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Edinburgh. Scotland Posts: 2,532	I did read it in a paper. However, given the British press, that's not a testament to accuracy.

10-09-2002, 02:26 AM	#19
Lord Asriel Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Essex, UK Posts: 467	I can believe that some people would hold a view like that. I personally hold with reducing use of oil and petro-chemical products, but for environmental reasons, not fossil rights reasons. I can believe that the conservative press would freely exaggerate the story as well. Incidentally, while I should have been working, I dug out <a href="http://www.earthsave.bc.ca/materials/articles/articles/health/comparative.html" target="_blank">this article</a>. It supports my case, but not being scientifically trained, I'd appreciate opinions on it.

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