Amie

Hi Sabine
I absolutely agree with this...
speaking of cremation, while I was in school we each had to do a report on one of the saints. I did my report on Joan of Arc. While I was collecting my information about her life I remember one book stated that after she was burned, a guard was sifting through her ashes and they found her heart. not burned at all. I remember that was in only one book I was using and as I gave my report I more so talked about her life than about her being burned. I remember at the end of my oral report my teacher turned to the class and said "yeah and they found her heart among the ashes" she marked me down for forgetting to mention what she felt was the most importnat part about of her life. I remember Shannon sitting in the front row said "wow they found her heart in ashes, Amie was it still beating?"

sometimes I think its more important to concentrate on their lives and their works and their efforts they had while living than their deaths as fasinating as they may be I think for me it is because I just don't have the answers I wish I did. While I hold the saints in high esteem I also dont know about their bodies after death, ultimately it makes little difference as that is not a deciding factor of my faith but it is an interesting topic. Their physical bodies are just that and to propose that something was extraordinarily presevered due to profound faith or immense love God had for them seems a bit unfair to the saints who did decomposed, like we do after death. kind of like Why didn't God preserve all the saints? I am inclined to think there must be another explanation to the preservation of their physical bodies. I could be wrong though, it could be divine.

Regardless, some will look at the body of the saint and say "it is how it is due to the divine" while others will say "there are other explanations"
Some people will see God in a tomato while others just see seeds...

(((Sabine)))
Amie~

Amos

Yes but I did not read the entire tread because I'd rather not get involved in silly religous arguments.

I believe in the transformation of the mind, soul, and body, and from this follows that eternal life can be a reality on earth as it is in heaven. If that includes the preservation of our coporeal body in an extraodinary way, that will then be just the way it is. It is not my ambition to convince anybody here that this is true but I have included a hint that it is a universal phenomema wherein protestants (and etheists by extension) are excluded. I think it was our dear friend Brighid who cited an example of excavations in Vegas where they found the remains of 15 corpses and the only incurruptable body was that of a Chinese man. I could add here now that this does indeed line up with the notion that in the spiritual domein called Christendom heaven is for Catholics only. In addition to this did I suggest that in its origen the purpose for a wake was that absense of foul odor served as evidence that the person was a saint and had lived in a transformed body.

A soul does not require preservation because it has no corporeal existence but is the effectice cause for the preservation of the body. The preservation of the body begins on earth which is why there is no sicknes nor pain in heaven and if after transfomation earth is like heaven there is no sickness nor pain on earth either.

I don't think God cares about us after we die because he is the God of the living and not of the dead.

Sabine Grant

Dear Amos... oh oh... so since I am not a catholic, I can or will never see heaven? oh boy... you are even more restrictive than most protestant fundies.
Will you file a protest to God when you face all the folks you have established should not be in heaven? What if God were to not follow your reasoning? what if He were to disagree with your restrictions?
now now Amos... in my simplistic faith not justified by reason or logic I do not take the place of God to evaluate who will spend eternal life with Him. I do not even venture to think that whoever does not believe as I do will be percluded from that eternal notion. I do not even venture theologizing on my own limited understanding.
Do you realize that if I even if my belief is wrong, I still would have been able to live with the hope for all human beings and as a result I will not have made so many people think that they are a bunch of unworthy subjects....but if you are wrong... ouch ouch... how many folks will you have ostercized and isolated from the notion of God with your personal restrictions? you will not be able to do it all over again Amos. Eternity is now.

Amie

you don't have to be catholic to go to heaven.

beyelzu

I think sabine said that most or some atheists dont feel this way. I dont see how that is possible. Personally, I feel that god is santa for adults, I generally dont say that cuz its rude. The difference between Mad Kally and me, when it comes to dealing with theists, isnt ideological. We just come across differently. After reading some of her posts though, I have come to think that we have similar points of view and generally different ways of expressing that point of view


Lets face it everyone like it or not
blasphemy is funny as hell



in conclusion with a quote from Hole

I dont really miss god

but i sure miss santa claus

Amie

God. santa. apples. oranges.

Mad Kally

My mother told me all Catholics are going to hell. Is my mother a liar?

As if there were such places as heaven and hell

I like you.

Amie

Well I really do not know your mom but if she is saying that all catholics are going to hell she sounds a little bit misguided because I do not think anyone is in a position to tell anyone else who is going to hell. Thats not our decision to make.
Kally I think you should start emotionally preparing now to spend an eternity in Heaven with myself, Sabine, Amos and Gemma. you too Beyelzu. BWAHAHAHAHAHA
Eternity with us, what more could you ask for

I need some coffee

beyelzu

Mad Kally,

after reading some of your posts, I have come to the conclusion that your mother was wrong about a great number of things and a little insane in the religious way. Hell, at least she wasnt a Jehovah's witness was she?


ps. I spent a year in foster care with a jehovah's witness she was pretty psychotic.

beyelzu

god-- do good go to heaven
santa---do good get gifts

god--- do bad go to hell
santa--do bad get coal


seems kind of similar to me.

(I would just assume drop this line of argument, but if you persist so will I. )