Mageth

I believe that it's not logical to disbelieve the possibilty of god(s). To say "god does not exist", is an ignorant statement, especially if you are scientific-minded.

Speaking as an atheist, I simply lack belief in god(s). I do not claim that "no god exists" (though I have seen some make logical arguments to this effect). One can logically make the claim, however, that particular gods do not exist (e.g. the Christian god).

K

I don't think many people here claim that "god does not exist. Most seem to claim that there is no evidence to support the belief that a god exists. Many also claim the specific gods (like Allah or the Christian God) are logically impossible and therefore don't exist. Or that there is evidence from the world around us that makes the existence of certain gods extremely remote given the attributes generally used to describe those gods.

Zentraedi

You don't. Big black sphere for you, and if you say how am I going to know its a sphere, I may have to reach through my computer and choke you

Lets get through this please. Do you have fear of attempting to step through the sphere or not? The reason why you would even have the inclination to step into it, would be that you think it may be a "portal", got it? Fear of the unknown. Yea or Nay? If you do have fear of stepping into the sphere and being trapped maybe in another time, space you fear the unkown. Maybe, there is no air, light, food, way back.

[ November 01, 2002: Message edited by: Zentraedi ]</p>

Zentraedi

Yep, that covers about all of them. I don't claim to be an atheist, because the word is a misnomer. I don't think anyone should claim to be an atheist and not claim "god does not exist".

Zentraedi

To the cannibals it is, but not to me, one of a different moral code. The whole point to the topic is that reason is based on perspective, and without the perspective of a religious aspect, you may have a less than desirable sense of morality. Hence, why atheism may depend on morals rooted in religion.

Zentraedi

The example is to prove you have fear of the unknown. Read nothing more into it.

Mageth

Lets get through this please. Do you have fear of attempting to step through the sphere or not? The reason why you would even have the inclination to step into it, would be that you think it may be a "portal", got it? Fear of the unknown. Yea or Nay? If you do have fear of stepping into the sphere and being trapped maybe in another time, space you fear the unkown. Maybe, there is no air, light, food, way back.

Let me put it this way, I don't fear that I will ever be placed in this hypothetical situation. I'm an aportalist as well as an atheist.

However, if I encountered this hypothetical mysterious sphere, I would investigate it to try to determine what it was before assuming it was a portal. I wouldn't fear it as a portal (which, in your hypothetical, is something I would seem to "know") until I determined it was a portal. Then my fear would be of something I know - a portal which, according to your hypothetical, may lead to "known" dangers (no air, no light, no food, no way back, which are all things I "know" and fear). I wouldn't fear any "unknown" dangers on the other side of the portal because I don't "know" what those unknown dangers are, so how can I fear them?

Eudaimonist

There are too many mays in your argument. If you think that an atheistic culture cannot produce a healthy society, please make an argument. (State the height of the hurdle of healthiness too, so we know you aren't talking about some Utopia.)

Simply saying that an atheistic culture might not produce a healthy society isn't saying much. It might produce a better society, or one at least as good. We won't know for sure until we try, now will we? Why should we think that the project would be doomed to failure?

[ November 01, 2002: Message edited by: Eudaimonist ]</p>

K

Atheist is a-theist - without theology. Why do you insist that should require a positive claim of the non-existence of any god?

Mageth

To the cannibals it is, but not to me, one of a different moral code. The whole point to the topic is that reason is based on perspective, and without the perspective of a religious aspect, you may have a less than desirable sense of morality. Hence, why atheism may depend on morals rooted in religion.

I can think of a reason not based on religious morals to not practice cannibalism. Humans carry communicable diseases that "like" other humans, and it's not a good health practice to eat other humans (unless your plane crashes in the Andes ).

A better example may be smoking. While some religions carry taboos against tobacco (and others use it in their rituals), health concerns raised in the late 20th century have led to social "taboos" against smoking based on reason and not on "morals". It's more reasonable for me to choose healthy lungs and longer life than to enjoy fleeting pleasure of cigarettes.