Freethought & Rationalism Archive

missus_gumby · 08-13-2002, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sowthistle:
Is it my imagination, or was GeoTheo's last contribution to the dabate a complete non-sequitur?

ST

Yes! What the *%^� is it doing in there?

Mageth · 08-13-2002, 03:30 PM

He seems to be attempting to point out that Christians aren't alone in their homophobia and bigotry.

[ August 13, 2002: Message edited by: Mageth ]

Bree · 08-14-2002, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mageth:

He seems to be attempting to point out that Christians aren't alone in their homophobia and bigotry.

And tried using a country which is "non-Christian" to demonstrate his point

. However, he seems to have forgotten that, while Japan may very well be the most non-Christian country in the world (I don't know if that's true or not), it also has several societal reasons other than Christianity for not being open to homosexuality.

St. Robert · 08-14-2002, 06:06 PM

A philosophy should never be judged by its abuse.

Bree · 08-14-2002, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by St. Robert:
A philosophy should never be judged by its abuse.

But rather by the actions of the majority of people who follow

.

Autonemesis · 08-14-2002, 08:04 PM

It seems to me he is admitting that Christianity does indeed promote gay and lesbian bigotry, and is now ready to argue about how much.

Dr Rick · 08-15-2002, 08:33 AM

...And with this mornings post, Theo appears to be attempting to justify Christian bigotry against homosexuals even as he denies it exists:

Putting homosexual sex into the same category as all other human failings (sins) does not make Christianity bigoted toward homosexuality.

It sure does. Christianity is bigoted against homosexuals just as it is against murderers and adulterers. It prejudges all of them by labeling their behaviors as "sinful". The difference is that the prejudice against murderers is acceptable and shared by most non-thiests in part because we believe a priori that murder is harmful to other individuals and society.

Rick

St. Robert · 08-15-2002, 01:06 PM

Behavior shouldn't be the basis of an individual's identity, but identity should be the basis of an individual's behavior.

I do believe that homosexual sex is, as a behavior, morally displeasing to God. Does that mean I hate homosexuals? Of course, not. Hating homosexuals would be equally as displeasing to God.

Christians should hate sin especially their own. Jesus asked: "Why do you point out the splinter in your brother's eye and ignore the plank in your own eye?" Great question. One in which many Christians and non-Christians could find wisdom.

Mageth · 08-15-2002, 01:15 PM

Behavior shouldn't be the basis of an individual's identity, but identity should be the basis of an individual's behavior.

That seems to be the crux of the problem. Many allow their identity as Christians (which includes the notion of "god abhors homosexuality") to serve as a basis of their behavior (e.g. bigotry against homosexuals, opposing rights for gays&lesbians, etc.).

Novowels · 08-15-2002, 01:43 PM

Erm. I don't see how GeoTheo's last couple of arguments about the Japanese hushing up homosexual behavior compares to whether or not Christianity promotes bigotry. GeoTheo seems to be thinking "because there's two different promoters of bigotry in the world, the other one does not exist" or something. What horrible logic.

08-13-2002, 03:30 PM	#42
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	He seems to be attempting to point out that Christians aren't alone in their homophobia and bigotry. [ August 13, 2002: Message edited by: Mageth ]</p>

08-15-2002, 08:33 AM	#47
Dr Rick Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: USA Posts: 5,393	...And with this mornings post, Theo appears to be attempting to justify Christian bigotry against homosexuals even as he denies it exists: <strong>Putting homosexual sex into the same category as all other human failings (sins) does not make Christianity bigoted toward homosexuality.</strong> It sure does. Christianity is bigoted against homosexuals just as it is against murderers and adulterers. It prejudges all of them by labeling their behaviors as "sinful". The difference is that the prejudice against murderers is acceptable and shared by most non-thiests in part because we believe a priori that murder is harmful to other individuals and society. Rick

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08-14-2002, 06:06 PM	#44
St. Robert Regular Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 170	A philosophy should never be judged by its abuse.

08-14-2002, 08:04 PM	#46
Autonemesis Contributor Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: I've left FRDB for good, due to new WI&P policy Posts: 12,048	It seems to me he is admitting that Christianity does indeed promote gay and lesbian bigotry, and is now ready to argue about how much.

08-15-2002, 01:06 PM	#48
St. Robert Regular Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 170	Behavior shouldn't be the basis of an individual's identity, but identity should be the basis of an individual's behavior. I do believe that homosexual sex is, as a behavior, morally displeasing to God. Does that mean I hate homosexuals? Of course, not. Hating homosexuals would be equally as displeasing to God. Christians should hate sin especially their own. Jesus asked: "Why do you point out the splinter in your brother's eye and ignore the plank in your own eye?" Great question. One in which many Christians and non-Christians could find wisdom.

08-15-2002, 01:15 PM	#49
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	Behavior shouldn't be the basis of an individual's identity, but identity should be the basis of an individual's behavior. That seems to be the crux of the problem. Many allow their identity as Christians (which includes the notion of "god abhors homosexuality") to serve as a basis of their behavior (e.g. bigotry against homosexuals, opposing rights for gays&lesbians, etc.).

08-15-2002, 01:43 PM	#50
Novowels Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Posts: 1,658	Erm. I don't see how GeoTheo's last couple of arguments about the Japanese hushing up homosexual behavior compares to whether or not Christianity promotes bigotry. GeoTheo seems to be thinking "because there's two different promoters of bigotry in the world, the other one does not exist" or something. What horrible logic.

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