Freethought & Rationalism Archive

tribalbeeyatch · 04-28-2003, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wiploc
[BThe way I see it (and this is my preferred usage, not the "right" usage) agnosticism is the admission that you can't prove whether there's a god, and atheism is the admission that you really believe there isn't. There's no conflict between them.
crc [/B]

If I may hone your definitions a bit, atheism is the admission that you don't believe there is. Note that this can also include the belief that there isn't, but it doesn't necessarily.

SULPHUR · 04-29-2003, 03:00 AM

What about gnostic and agnostic?

Ronin · 04-29-2003, 03:46 AM

Yeah, or apatheistic...until your nation gets all fundy about sky fairies blessing shit and funneling money to goofy cults.

SULPHUR · 04-29-2003, 04:34 AM

Did you use the CD or the 12 volume version. If you you used the latter it was not made up by theists.I can name the the people responsible if need be.

Wiploc · 04-29-2003, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SULPHUR
Did you use the CD or the 12 volume version. If you you used the latter it was not made up by theists.I can name the the people responsible if need be.

I used the two-volume version.
crc

Wiploc · 04-29-2003, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tribalbeeyatch
If I may hone your definitions a bit, atheism is the admission that you don't believe there is. Note that this can also include the belief that there isn't, but it doesn't necessarily.

Yep, that's good too. Sometimes I use the word one way, and sometimes the other.
crc

Wiploc · 04-29-2003, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SULPHUR
What about gnostic and agnostic?

The Gnostics were some kind of middle age church. I thought your definition of agnostic was fine. In fact, so was your definition of atheist. What I took exception to was the implication that your defininition was right and others were wrong. (And even in that, I could have been misreading you.)
crc

tensorproduct · 04-30-2003, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tribalbeeyatch
Ummm...? What is a question of faith? To call yourself an agnostic is to avoid the question of theism/atheism. As I said before, there is no middle ground between them.

Agnosticism doesn't claim to be the middle ground, it is an entirely different point of view.

tribalbeeyatch · 04-30-2003, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tensorproduct
Agnosticism doesn't claim to be the middle ground, it is an entirely different point of view.

Exactly. If you recognize this, then you understand why it is annoying to have agnostics claiming some sort of intellectual high ground vis-a-vis atheists. Agnostics don't have a better answer to the a/theism question, they have answered a different question altogether.

tribalbeeyatch · 04-30-2003, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wiploc
Yep, that's good too. Sometimes I use the word one way, and sometimes the other.
crc

There's a big difference between the two wordings, though. The way that you worded it on this thread excludes the majority of atheists on IIDB (I think).

04-29-2003, 04:34 AM	#104
SULPHUR Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: hobart,tasmania Posts: 551	wiploc Did you use the CD or the 12 volume version. If you you used the latter it was not made up by theists.I can name the the people responsible if need be.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

04-29-2003, 03:00 AM	#102
SULPHUR Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: hobart,tasmania Posts: 551	What about gnostic and agnostic?

04-29-2003, 03:46 AM	#103
Ronin Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Mississippi Posts: 5,047	Yeah, or apatheistic...until your nation gets all fundy about sky fairies blessing shit and funneling money to goofy cults.

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.