Freethought & Rationalism Archive

christ-on-a-stick · 01-30-2003, 01:31 PM

Loren,

Quote:

Besides, who says that acting that's not enjoyable is somehow wrong. Does an actor or actress never have something unpleasant in a scene? I've seen discussions of photo shoots where they discussed the physical difficulty of getting a shot. I remember Playboy once had a photo series of girls on ice. Given how Playboy dresses it's models they were obviously cold while doing it.

I certainly agree with you here - when I use the words "uncomfortable" or "unpleasant" I mean in a "mental" way... certainly there were times, even for the most basic-looking still shots that a body part would be cramping up when trying to hold a certain pose, or it was incredibly hot under the lights, etc.... all in a day's work, really, and not a big deal.

A better word for me to use would be "degraded" - I chose not to do anything that made me feel degraded. A very personal thing; what might be something I would choose not to do for that reason might be no problem for someone else.

Viti · 01-30-2003, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Shall I speak of the addictive grip it holds on millions, or the devastation it has caused the many lives of those in the industry and the marriages/relationships it has ruined?

These problems are not a direct result of the porn industry, this is a disingenuous appeal to emotion.

*In the case of addictions, the problem is with the addict not the object of their addiction. "Millions of people" are addicted to food, alcohol, work, religion, gambling; people can be addicted to anything...how does that make those things "wrong" for the millions of people who can enjoy them without a problem?

*Do you have any references, studies, numbers or any kind of evidence in regards to the "devastation" of many lives of those in the industry?

*Do you have any references, studies, numbers or any kind of evidence in regards to the marriages/relationships that have been ruined?

Quote:

Should I focus on how it degrades women by objectifying them and treating them like hunks of flesh good for nothing more than sexual gratification?

How does it degrade women and who is doing the objectifying? If the woman making the porn enjoys her work, or has no problems with it, and those that enjoy watching it appreciate her work...where is the moral issue? Because YOU think it's wrong?

Many of us do jobs we dislike, or have our talents exploited in "regular" businesses every day. Why is it less degrading to be an underpaid laborer while owners or managers make lots of money off your hard work while they sit on their ass?

Quote:

Then again what do I know? I'm still on my first marriage of 7 years, enjoying the wonders of sexual intimacy without the benefit of pornography.

So what does this prove? I am still on my first marriage of 12 years, enjoying the wonders of sexual intimacy AND the occasional porn movie, lap dance or sex toy.

livius drusus · 01-30-2003, 01:56 PM

Odemus -

Why the vicious tone? Your last post to COAS was bristling with sarcasm. Considering that you are the one implying she is a whore and a piece of meat due to her profession, I am at a loss to explain why you are the defensive one. Your sexual nirvana of a marriage is not threatened by the mere existence of a well-adjusted and content porn actress. Your assumptions about the industry might be, but why take that so personally?

dangin · 01-30-2003, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Odemus

Shall I speak of the addictive grip it holds on millions, or the devastation it has caused the many lives of those in the industry and the marriages/relationships it has ruined?

Speaking with the first hand knowledge of a "porn addict" I have to admit my shame. I'm regularly addicted to porn.

FOR ABOUT FIFTEEN MINUTES

Then I have to smoke a cigarette and I couldn't have even the slightest interest in it again for about 2 hours. I mean I'd still watch it, but only to critique the lighting and editing. (OK, and sometimes the acting)

If porn is able to divide a marriage, then something other than porn is amiss with said relationship.

Viti · 01-30-2003, 06:18 PM

Bump

beyelzu · 01-30-2003, 06:54 PM

christ on a stick,

thanks for making the posts in this thread. Your attitude kind of reminds me of my best friend sam's attitude towards stripping. very matter of fact.
She is also a nontheist.

I have wondered if its just alot easier for a nontheist to be in the sex industry because the lack of religious guilt.

Sadly being sam's friend has ruined strip clubs for me, its hard to really enjoy when you are thinking about the technical stuff you know.

Hopefully, reading your posts wont ruin porn for me. Cuz then I would have to delete about 4 gigs off of my comp.

and throw away several magazines and a couple of videos.

which would just be a waste.

christ-on-a-stick · 01-30-2003, 07:18 PM

Beyelzu,

Quote:

I have wondered if its just alot easier for a nontheist to be in the sex industry because the lack of religious guilt.

This certainly factored into it for me. After my deconversion, I found that the realization that my sexuality (and expressing it freely) was NOT inherently sinful/shameful/dirty to be incredibly liberating.

No great big "eye in the sky" watching over me with disapproval...

Especially with regard to bisexuality. Getting over the indoctrinated idea that there was something "wrong with me" or "unnatural" about my feelings was like a huge weight off my shoulders. I found myself attracted to girls as well as boys from a pretty young age - 12 or 13 - and the years after that I spent in fundyland were confusing and unneccessarily laden with guilt over my secret "weird" feelings.

Now I am truly "free at last"... to be myself, and enjoy it!

Odemus · 01-30-2003, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by christ-on-a-stick
Somehow I doubt that the girl in question asked you if you would be interested in performing in a film, took your driver's license, social security number and personal information and had you fill out a 1099 and a comprehensive model release, did an HIV-test on the spot and presented you with original dated HIV tests for your partner(s) dated within 30 days, and then proceeded to escort you to the van for the scene (which was parked in a location zoned and permitted for commercial use).

So once that procedure is carried out the action of selling my body for sex miraculously transforms from prostition to a legitimate first step into a skilled acting career?

Who's playing semantics now?

christ-on-a-stick · 01-30-2003, 09:22 PM

I'm on the fly out the door right now so I don't have time to respond fully 'til tomorrow, Odemus, but I just have to do one thing real quick...

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

Ahhhh, that feels better. Be back later!!!

P.S. PLEASE don't tell me that's all you have to say with all of the excellent points that have been raised by LadyShea and numerous others....'cause that would be cause for more

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

'Til then have a most fantastic evening!

Viti · 01-30-2003, 09:32 PM

Odemus, we all sell something of ourselves. Laborers sell their bodies, scientists and teachers sell their knowledge and intellect, all of us sell our time, energy, and talent...it's called "making a living". Why is selling your time and energy by having sex different than selling the same time and energy doing accounting?

What COAS was saying that jumping into a van with strangers for money is STUPID and reckless, as opposed to treating it like any other job, with safety precautions and paychecks.

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01-30-2003, 01:56 PM	#53
livius drusus Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Selva Oscura Posts: 4,120	Odemus - Why the vicious tone? Your last post to COAS was bristling with sarcasm. Considering that you are the one implying she is a whore and a piece of meat due to her profession, I am at a loss to explain why you are the defensive one. Your sexual nirvana of a marriage is not threatened by the mere existence of a well-adjusted and content porn actress. Your assumptions about the industry might be, but why take that so personally?

01-30-2003, 06:18 PM	#55
Viti Contributor Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Down South Posts: 12,879	Bump

01-30-2003, 06:54 PM	#56
beyelzu Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: the peach state ga I am a metaphysical naturalist Posts: 2,869	christ on a stick, thanks for making the posts in this thread. Your attitude kind of reminds me of my best friend sam's attitude towards stripping. very matter of fact. She is also a nontheist. I have wondered if its just alot easier for a nontheist to be in the sex industry because the lack of religious guilt. Sadly being sam's friend has ruined strip clubs for me, its hard to really enjoy when you are thinking about the technical stuff you know. Hopefully, reading your posts wont ruin porn for me. Cuz then I would have to delete about 4 gigs off of my comp. and throw away several magazines and a couple of videos. which would just be a waste.

01-30-2003, 09:22 PM	#59
christ-on-a-stick Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Durango, Colorado Posts: 7,116	I'm on the fly out the door right now so I don't have time to respond fully 'til tomorrow, Odemus, but I just have to do one thing real quick... :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: Ahhhh, that feels better. Be back later!!! P.S. PLEASE don't tell me that's all you have to say with all of the excellent points that have been raised by LadyShea and numerous others....'cause that would be cause for more :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: 'Til then have a most fantastic evening!

01-30-2003, 09:32 PM	#60
Viti Contributor Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Down South Posts: 12,879	Odemus, we all sell something of ourselves. Laborers sell their bodies, scientists and teachers sell their knowledge and intellect, all of us sell our time, energy, and talent...it's called "making a living". Why is selling your time and energy by having sex different than selling the same time and energy doing accounting? What COAS was saying that jumping into a van with strangers for money is STUPID and reckless, as opposed to treating it like any other job, with safety precautions and paychecks.

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