mibby529

Unfortunately ppl fall for these types. Like, I can think of a million ways you can die in a fake Inipi. I mean, all that corner-cutting...Definitely a Darwin Awards candidate.

My favorite guy has always been Harley Reagan, an Irishman who claims to be half Cherokee. (I've never met anyone who was more than a quarter. LOL) Anyway, he does these orgies as a Cherokee ritual. (Talk about hitting below the belt!) And apparently Cherokee boys lose their virginity at twelve now. LOL He sometimes claims to be Mayan. He's neither.

squiddy

I don't know if my 2cents is worth anything in this discussion, but what the heck.

First off let me say I consider myself a "pagan" in the respect that I believe that the earth, life, the universe and everthing (sorry, couldn't resist) is alive, vital, and connected to everything else: me, you, every molecule, atom, etc. BUT I absolutely believe that trying to "convert" anyone to your/my way of thinking is just plain wrong. I don't care what you believe, if anything. I have no interest in making any sort of religious, quasi-religious, anti-religious point whatsoever. Does god/God exist? Beats the shit outta me. And furthermore, I'm not sure it really matters. We're here and that's good enough for me. Don't especially care how we got here. I think that what we do while we're here is what's important. Why? For some eternal reward? Nope. Just because it's the decent responsible thing to do-- as a sentient being.

I am also a firm believer that laughter is the key to salvation. (whatever the heck the word "salvation" means! LOL) That's what drew me to this site in the first place. Just the forum name "Internet Infidels," you just gotta love it! And I have not been disappointed! I just love the humor section.

I don't know if there's a God/gods/goddesses or not. But what I view as the god/goddess is that within me that connects me to everthing else in the universe. A wholeness of sorts. When I go out under the stars at night and look up, I just think "I'm part of all this!" And it's a wonderful feeling.

Thanks for listening.

~Squiddy

brighid

There are certainly a wide variety of neo-pagans out there, some of the flaky variety and some of the not so flaky variety. My group is half atheists and half deists of sorts (we now have 9 and so a little more then half leans to the deist side) … there is certainly a range of belief in the supernatural within our own group. I and the other atheist/agnostic types see the Gods and Goddesses as merely archetypal representations of different aspects of ones psyche and nothing more. A few others truly believe in the actual and physical existence of these deities and then a few others don’t really have a firm opinion. But none of this brings conflict in the group as we are allowed and encouraged to follow our individual consciences and there is NO dogma. We are very creative and each member brings a unique perspective to the group. We vary from age 29-50 some thing, although you could never tell by looking at the older members of the group that they aren’t about 30. I sure hope to look that good when I am 50!

I think the neo-pagan movement (at least in my limited experience) is really moving away from the earlier ramblings of authentic, historical practice. We just don’t know and there isn’t enough evidence to support those claims. Margot Adler does a good job in Drawing Down the Moon, and although she is a well known pagan (and you can read a column by her on Beliefnet) I don’t think she presented an overly biased opinion. It’s rather heavy reading though and I found much of it a bit boring, but informative. I can’t compare it against any of the other books that have been recommended.

I realize that most people think how can you be an atheist and a pagan … well, because I can. I truly enjoy the rituals behind paganism and this is quite possibly a hold over from my years of Catholic upbringing. I enjoy the company of these women and it is definitely a female bonding experience within our group. Even though I no longer believe in the actual existence of the Gods or Goddesses I still get the same physical response in rituals such as a sense of euphoria, increased energy (such that it is palpable) and a greater sense of personal balance. But it is all very meditative for me. I thoroughly enjoy my experiences within circle. These are women that I trust more then others because they have earned my trust and respect. We share very similar views and it helps to have a support network. They are a part of it. I also know that no matter what time of day or night it is, if I am in need one or all will be there to help. They deeply and truly care about my well being and did so before we ever became “sisters.” I don’t know if that kinship is a typical aspect within Paganism or simply within certain human communities that derived their membership based on mutual thought, trust and respect. It is simply something I feel I need in my life. I could not be a part of any organization that forced me to subvert my inherent characteristics or encouraged me to discriminate in any way against others. It is one of the few places in this world where my femininity is an asset and it is honored. Furthermore I don’t have to be dishonest with my lack of belief in Gods. I can be both, without conflict and enjoy high standing and respect within my group.

We DO NOT proselytize in any way and it takes a VERY, VERY long to time before one who has potential will be allowed into our inner circle. I definitely enjoy the company of pagans over most other theists, although I have a fond spot in my heart for more then a few traditional theists. Plus, we throw WAY better parties

Brighid

jess

of course, there is in-ranks dissention...
<a href="http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Square/7290/" target="_blank">wiccan style...</a>

as you can see, not all pagans are doofs who believe everything... (not that you said they were)

Dan828

I stumbled on this one a while back. The guy has some issues, but there is quite a bit of information that is highly critical of wicca.

<a href="http://www.whywiccanssuck.com/" target="_blank">http://www.whywiccanssuck.com/</a>

ps418

This describes me about 10 years ago, I'm embarassed to say. I was into Thelemic Magick and divination. I spent a small fortune buying old, out of print Aliester Crowley books. I had no doubt that I had successfully employed magick to influence other people. I could also convince others of my magickal abilities, provided they were gullible, had taken enough LSD, and were exposed to the right suggestions. . . The only thing of value I took from those years was yogic practice

To your friends, I'd recommend a simple logic textbook. What they need is not a critique of Wicca or divination per se, but simply to learn how to think on a very basic level. That's where 'recovery' started for me.

Eudaimonist

I agree. This is the best approach by far.