Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Radorth · 01-18-2003, 05:38 PM

It means your soul is precious in God's eyes, and the only thing he hates is the way you try to get legitimate needs fulfilled. To me "sin" is what you do when you will not give God a real chance to meet your REAL needs his way. You think you need homosexual sex and nothing else will do. He thinks you need something else. Personally I don't think you have to give up anything to know God's love and intentions for you, other than personal control.

Thus the thief who simply decides Jesus is "Lord" is saved.

Rad

Daggah · 01-18-2003, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Thus the thief who simply decides Jesus is "Lord" is saved.

Guess the Lutherans in WWII-era Germany who decided that Jesus is Lord are saved as well.

And thus it doesn't matter that they helped slaughter 11 million innocent people, including 6 million jews. They're saved.

Can one be saved and not be a 'true Christian'?

Bree · 01-18-2003, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
To me "sin" is what you do when you will not give God a real chance to meet your REAL needs his way. You think you need homosexual sex and nothing else will do. He thinks you need something else.

So is that "something else" sex with men? Does God really care who I sleep with?

HelenM · 01-19-2003, 04:12 AM

God as portrayed in the Bible cares about every detail of peoples' lives so, yes, by implication He would care about what you do sexually.

Helen

HRG · 01-19-2003, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
[B]It means your soul is precious in God's eyes, and the only thing he hates is the way you try to get legitimate needs fulfilled. To me "sin" is what you do when you will not give God a real chance to meet your REAL needs his way. You think you need homosexual sex and nothing else will do.

If he has defined his purpose in life in this particular way, nothing else will do. Period.

Quote:

He thinks you need something else.

Why do you think that the poster is not qualified to define his purpose and thus to determine what his needs are ? Let God define God's needs, and let us define our needs.

This distinction between our needs and our REAL needs reminds me of Lenin's insistence that only the Communist party represented the OBJECTIVE interests of the proletariate - no matter what the proletarians actually wanted.

Quote:

Personally I don't think you have to give up anything to know God's love and intentions for you, other than personal control.

What about my intentions for me ?

"Humans breed pigs for a purpose: bacon.
Does this make life meaningful for the pig ? "
(S. Johannsen)

Regards,
HRG.

Radorth · 01-19-2003, 08:02 AM

I never thought I'd meet a large group of people who are absolutely convinced they know what is best for themselves and can't agree on anything.

Then I came to II.

"Whatever you feel is right for you is right for you." Is there some sort of relationship between skepticism and the ability to make truth into something new each day? It certainly seems so.

I can always tell when skeptics are struggling to find meaningful response. We start hearing the most mindless analogies to Hitler, Stalin, etc. or boneheaded assertions that Christians "all" want unbelievers to burn in hell.

Who the hell cares what you think Christians want anyway? It's what Jesus and the apostles said that counts. Find it in the NT or be quiet about it if you wish to seem "rational." (And please don't use known interpolated verses)

Rad

Daggah · 01-19-2003, 08:27 AM

Radorth,

You're rambling again.

I ask again,

Can one be saved and not be a 'true Christian'?

Radorth · 01-19-2003, 10:33 AM

At some point yes. I already answered this. Try to keep up.

Rad

Daggah · 01-19-2003, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
At some point yes. I already answered this. Try to keep up.

Rad

So you surely wouldn't mind answering again. I'm not about to go on a mission re-reading all of the BS you've posted on this forum looking for one probably-weak explanation of how your two views aren't contradictory.

scombrid · 01-19-2003, 11:52 AM

Quote:

I never said every one who falls away was not a Christian.

I don't agree that everyone who says they were a Christian is one, but I do believe simply that those who were still are.

The part that I highlighted states by default that �one who falls away was not a Christian.� You assert that once a Christian, always a Christian. The obvious corollary is that anyone that has fallen away was never a Christian. Please decide which you actually believe. Either �I never said everyone who falls away was not a Christian� or �those who were still are�. You can�t have both.

3. God, since He isn't so narcissistic and insecure that He would require slobbering worship from puny humans, doesn't care if people believe in Him or not at all. "

Quote:

Of course this contradicts most atheist assertions about the Christian' God''s narcissism, so we can't call it "just as likely" since it has no support even from your "rational" peers.

BZZZZZZZTTTTT wrong. We often state that the Christian concept of God is nonsensical in that an omnipotent/omniscient/omni benevolent being shouldn�t be needy as to require worship. LHQB was just making an unsupported assertion from the atheist standpoint to show that handwaving can work any way you like to support your argument. Again, perhaps god is happy that someone has quit groveling. God as posited by the bibble is probably embarrassed to have people groveling.

Quote:

We start hearing the most mindless analogies to Hitler, Stalin, etc. or boneheaded assertions

Yeah, Christians do come up with some lousy analogies trying smear the atheist worldview. Stalin and pol pot were murderers in the name of atheism and Darwin inspired Hilter to Holocaust. Strawmen galore�

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01-18-2003, 05:38 PM	#81
Radorth Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,872	It means your soul is precious in God's eyes, and the only thing he hates is the way you try to get legitimate needs fulfilled. To me "sin" is what you do when you will not give God a real chance to meet your REAL needs his way. You think you need homosexual sex and nothing else will do. He thinks you need something else. Personally I don't think you have to give up anything to know God's love and intentions for you, other than personal control. Thus the thief who simply decides Jesus is "Lord" is saved. Rad

01-19-2003, 04:12 AM	#84
HelenM Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Ill Posts: 6,577	God as portrayed in the Bible cares about every detail of peoples' lives so, yes, by implication He would care about what you do sexually. Helen

01-19-2003, 08:02 AM	#86
Radorth Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,872	I never thought I'd meet a large group of people who are absolutely convinced they know what is best for themselves and can't agree on anything. Then I came to II. "Whatever you feel is right for you is right for you." Is there some sort of relationship between skepticism and the ability to make truth into something new each day? It certainly seems so. I can always tell when skeptics are struggling to find meaningful response. We start hearing the most mindless analogies to Hitler, Stalin, etc. or boneheaded assertions that Christians "all" want unbelievers to burn in hell. Who the hell cares what you think Christians want anyway? It's what Jesus and the apostles said that counts. Find it in the NT or be quiet about it if you wish to seem "rational." (And please don't use known interpolated verses) Rad

01-19-2003, 08:27 AM	#87
Daggah Banned Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Deployed to Kosovo Posts: 4,314	Radorth, You're rambling again. I ask again, Can one be saved and not be a 'true Christian'?

01-19-2003, 10:33 AM	#88
Radorth Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,872	At some point yes. I already answered this. Try to keep up. Rad

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