FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > IIDB ARCHIVE: 200X-2003, PD 2007 > IIDB Philosophical Forums (PRIOR TO JUN-2003)
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Today at 05:55 AM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-07-2003, 09:52 AM   #11
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 1,505
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by malookiemaloo
On Isaiah 45:7 my version (NIV) says 'I create disasters'. Can't comment on the precise meaning of the Hebrew to be honest.
That Outreach Judaism article comments on the NIV translation.

Understandably, the NIV translators saw fit to alter the prophet’s words by rendering the offensive Hebrew word rah as “disaster” instead of correctly translating it as “bad” or “evil.” The NIV Bible therefore mistranslates Isaiah 45:7 to read,

I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.

The word “disaster” inserted by the NIV is so ambiguous that the uninformed reader would easily come to the conclusion that it refers to such things as earthquakes and hurricanes. This skewed understanding created by the NIV mistranslation effectively conceals Isaiah’s original message. As mentioned above, the KJV (King James Version) does correctly translate this verse and render the Hebrew word rah as “evil.”


I did a concordance search for rah in Isaiah and it is used 19 times. The NIV doesn't consistently translate it as "disaster", sometimes it is translated as evil:

Isaiah 56:2
Blessed is the man who does this,
the man who holds it fast,
who keeps the Sabbath without desecrating it,
and keeps his hand from doing any evil."


I see those kinds of inconsistencies as interpretive translation, where the text is translated in a matter which reflects the interpreter's bias, rather than staying faithful to the text.

Quote:
I have never had a problem with God using evil for His purposes although, to many, this is a difficult area.
You seem to be fairly comfortable with it. Many Christians I have discussed such issues with are not.

Quote:
Theology of OT v NT? The only difference in I can see is that in Jesus taught us to call God our Father, whereas in the OT He is LORD, Lord, Lord God etc.
I think that Christians often twist the interpretations of the OT to fit their theology. I have found Jewish theology to be significantly different from the Christians.

Quote:
As a University professor once said 'the only difference between the OT and the NT is that in the NT the Word became flesh.'
According to OT theology, the concept of the Logos is heresy.

-Mike...
mike_decock is offline  
Old 05-07-2003, 10:07 AM   #12
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: St Louis area
Posts: 3,458
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by mike_decock
According to OT theology, the concept of the Logos is heresy.
That might be because it isn't even Christian in origin. It comes from Greek Stoic and Platonic philosophy. That didn't stop Hellenistic diaspora Jews, particularly in Alexandria (like Philo for instance) from incorporating it into their religious views however.
MortalWombat is offline  
Old 05-08-2003, 02:48 AM   #13
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: midwest usa
Posts: 1,203
Default Why are we interpreting what the bible says

God wrote the bible and said that the evil spirit from God.God gave the evil spirit or it came from God.

God also created a flat eath,and jesus is 2000 years late.

Or are you trying to say man wrote the bible?
mark9950 is offline  
Old 05-08-2003, 05:56 AM   #14
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 7,204
Default Re: Why are we interpreting what the bible says

Quote:
Originally posted by mark9950
God wrote the bible and said that the evil spirit from God.God gave the evil spirit or it came from God.

God also created a flat eath,and jesus is 2000 years late.

Or are you trying to say man wrote the bible?
God did not create a flat earth, and Jesus is not late - would you get a clue and stop spouting lame arguments that carry no weight at all because you have no understanding of the Bible whatsoever.
Magus55 is offline  
Old 07-29-2003, 03:52 PM   #15
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: midwest usa
Posts: 1,203
Default Oh maybe

Quote:
God did not create a flat earth, and Jesus is not late - would you get a clue and stop spouting lame arguments that carry no weight at all because you have no understanding of the Bible whatsoever.
I understand and believe the bible maybe you should

http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/febible.htm

I believe that it is wrong 100%.
mark9950 is offline  
Old 07-30-2003, 04:51 AM   #16
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 5,815
Default

Magus, why do you accuse others of having "no understanding of the Bible whatsoever" purely because THEY read what the Bible plainly says, whereas YOU do not?

Would you care to address the topic of this thread (properly, this time)?

God sent an evil spirit. You defied the Bible by quoting a Christian apologist instead. Those of us who actually understand the Bible have no problem with this: the Biblical God was never originally intended (by his inventors) to be omnibenevolent.
Jack the Bodiless is offline  
Old 07-30-2003, 09:51 AM   #17
Amos
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: What is the evil spirit from God

Quote:
Originally posted by mark9950
1 Sam 16:14
1 Sam 16:15
1 Sam 16:16
This spirit of melancholy is the same spirit that send Joseph back to Bethlehem to give an account of himself. The urge to do this came to him in a dream and this same dream of Joseph was the direct message from God to Mary by the angel Gabriel upon the command of the Lord who therefore was the cause of this persistent feeling of alienation.

So here we can say that Samuel received the notice that he was about to become the father of the child within. The harpist here is the equivalent of Gabriel and Marys canticle was the song he played.
 
Old 07-30-2003, 07:55 PM   #18
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: midwest usa
Posts: 1,203
Default Please

Quote:
This spirit of melancholy is the same spirit that send Joseph back to Bethlehem to give an account of himself.
Show me the proof of your claim.

My claim is that the evil spirit did come from God because God created evil.

ISA 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

God did do it God finally admitted it.
mark9950 is offline  
Old 07-31-2003, 12:10 PM   #19
Amos
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Please

Quote:
Originally posted by mark9950
Show me the proof of your claim.

My claim is that the evil spirit did come from God because God created evil.

ISA 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

God did do it God finally admitted it.
This here is "I the Lord" and not God. The Lord God is the second cause of creation and God is the first cause (see Gen. 1 and 2 on this where God created and Lord God formed that which God created).

The spirit of melancholy described here is involutional (persistent)and is a direct result of Lord God witholding his presense in our daily life.

Evil does not exist in reality (and therefore not in heaven) but is only a value judgement made in our lymbic system. It is based on the utility of our actions as seen from a human perspective.
 
Old 07-31-2003, 04:42 PM   #20
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Quezon City, Philippines
Posts: 1,994
Default

So Elohim is a different entity (or entities) from Yahweh? Then Christianity is not really monotheistic, as there are two different deities that were involved in the creation?
Secular Pinoy is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:15 PM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.