Freethought & Rationalism Archive

andrewcriddle · 04-22-2013, 12:38 PM

The Descent into Hades is almost certainly present in the 2nd century Odes of Solomon eg Ode 42

Quote:

Sheol saw me and was shattered, and Death ejected me and many with me.
I have been vinegar and bitterness to it, and I went down with it as far as its depth.
Then the feet and the head it released, because it was not able to endure my face.
And I made a congregation of living among his dead; and I spoke with them by living lips; in order that my word may not be unprofitable.
And those who had died ran towards me; and they cried out and said, Son of God, have pity on us.
And deal with us according to Your kindness, and bring us out from the bonds of darkness.
And open for us the door by which we may come out to You; for we perceive that our death does not touch You.
May we also be saved with You, because You are our Savior.
Then I heard their voice, and placed their faith in my heart.
And I placed my name upon their head, because they are free and they are mine.
Hallelujah.

Andrew Criddle

stephan huller · 04-22-2013, 01:31 PM

Clement of Alexandria also mentions the apostles going down to hell too if I am not mistaken.

andrewcriddle · 04-22-2013, 01:45 PM

There is a list of early examples (some possibly questionable) of this doctrine at
The_origin_of_the_Christian_doctrine_on_theDescens us_Christi_ad_Inferos

Andrew Criddle

(I recently blogged about the role of this doctrine in the early church orders. Google Mysteries of the Apostolic Tradition .)

mountainman · 04-26-2013, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

You invented this idea of satire as an epicycle to explain away evidence that did not fit your Constantinian origin of the gospels.

This epicycle claim is ridiculous.

If Constantine commissioned the fabrication of the canonical gospels there is yet the matter of the authorship of the non canonical gospels and acts to be explained. It directly follows that if Bullneck published bullshit there was going to be a massive controversy (Arian controversy) and we may expect a direct negative literary reaction (the non canonical material). This is not the same as an epicycle since it is a direct consequence.

εὐδαιμονία | eudaimonia

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04-22-2013, 01:31 PM	#72
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	Clement of Alexandria also mentions the apostles going down to hell too if I am not mistaken.

04-22-2013, 01:45 PM	#73
andrewcriddle Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Birmingham UK Posts: 4,876	There is a list of early examples (some possibly questionable) of this doctrine at The_origin_of_the_Christian_doctrine_on_theDescens us_Christi_ad_Inferos Andrew Criddle (I recently blogged about the role of this doctrine in the early church orders. Google Mysteries of the Apostolic Tradition .)

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