Postcard73

Another thing to consider is that there is almost no archaeological evidence at all to support the story of the Exodus and Conquest, while there is similarly no scientific evidence of the global flood. These are obviously some of the best known stories in the entire Bible, yet it seems almost certain they never happened. For me, that means the Bible is not a reliable source of knowledge. If those stories aren't true, then what else is falsely recorded in the Bible?

Enlighten Me

Ask your aunt to notice the similarity between "original sin" and an "evil spell' and tell her you don't believe in evil spells---especially evil spells that are broken by "magical blood."

Valdemar

I just remind myself of the horrors of Joshua and the Great Flood. Imagine Joshua putting men, women and children to the sword at the command of god. Imagine babies drowning because they are considered evil by a god who has a temper tantrum.

If god exists, he is a sadistic megalomaniac of... well... biblical proportions.

joedad

No reason to introduce outside information into the conversation. By that I mean I'd keep it to what you know and what she knows � specifically about this god she "believes in." You've really got to make the focus of this conversation her beliefs, and how she justifies them, and not your disbelief and how you justify it. Make sense? You are not on trial. It's her beliefs that are being examined. I'd ask her what it means to "Believe in a god." That's what I'd do first. I seriously doubt she's ever been asked this question.

Now that's really easy for me to do because a god being makes exactly as much sense to me today as a square circle. You're not to that point yet. You still have all those silly ideas to deal with and feel guilty over.

Ask her what her god being looks like. Seriously. And don't ever call her god "God." If she says it looks like a person, ask her which person, and then say, "So it has hair? It's 5 feet tall? It wears clothes? Always refer to it as "her god" or this "god being that she thinks is real." If you call her god being "God" you've already in a way granted it an individual existence. Be honest and tell her you'd like to understand how and why she thinks like she does, that it's never going to make you think these things called gods are any more real than gravity birds, but that you still are genuinely interested.

I'd ask her why she thinks she needs this thing. And I'd be genuinely curious and sincere. There is really no other way to be. I'd ask her if her beliefs about this god being are more important than her relationship with you. Could get interesting.

Ask her if she thinks newborns are sinners and deserve an eternal hell. I'm a parent so this one hits home. If she says yes, big trouble. When I run across the occasional person who tells me that their god being was justified in murdering everyone in the flood, including infants and toddlers, or was justified in doing the same things at other points in the bible, I know I'm talking with a potentially very dangerous person, someone who would kill for that god being, someone without regard for other life and lives, a real bigot, someone very ignorant. I let those people be. Hopefully this isn't your aunt.

Anyway, Pensee, that's the route I'd take. But if you're really interested in a quick tutorial of biblical absurdity,

The Skeptics Annotated Bible

is a pretty decent reference.

Jovial Reaper

Pensee: Pure, simple, uncomplicated, and rhetoric free:

Tell your aunt that you are exercising your God-Given, Free-Willed Right to disbelieve; period; end of discussion.

It can�t be (successfully) argued, and it completely eliminates the need to insult her beliefs (and possibly damage your relationship with her) in order to justify your own.

Why must everything be an overly-complex apologetics nightmare? The simplest solution is usually the best. You don�t believe . . . and, you don�t have to . . .

Just my opinion; take it or leave it. Regardless, good luck with your conversation,

-- Jovial Reaper

JR�s Tip of the Day: In spite of the warning label, Drain-O makes an excellent aperitif!

southernhybrid

In addition to all the other good suggestions, sometimes I just keep it very simple. If there was a god, why is she/he so very difficult to find? Why so many religious conflicts? What is the purpose of remaining so enigmatic, and what exactly do you even mean when you try to define god?



If they seem really upset, you can use that wonderful Asimov quote about choosing a god that judges one on the totality of their lives and not on what one believes. ( I don't remember the exact words ) That seems like the most sensible type of god if one must have one.

Lanakila

The skeptics annotated Bible is a good place to look for contradictory scriptures. They are lined up either by book, or categorized by evilness. For example you can find a list of scriptures proving God hates children.

Jovial Reaper

Hmmmm . . . . . . I have no problem whatsoever with, and, in fact, encourage a good, healthy skepticism; however, this �Skeptic�s Annotated Bible� seems more a schoolyard taunting of the Bible rather than a serious rebuttal. I, admittedly, only glanced at certain parts of the offered website; however, I found it to be more a juvenile celebration of how right the unbeliever is, and how stupid the Christian is, rather than a serious reference material of any kind.

If you like/(need) that sort of thing, then, hey, by all means, knock yourself out. Personally, I prefer a more objective analysis (pro AND con) . . .

Just my opinion,

--JR

JR�s Tip of the Day: Rattlesnakes make the perfect pet! Buy several, and let them roam free in your home!

Seeker630

I have no problem whatsoever with, and, in fact, encourage a good, healthy skepticism; however, this �Skeptic�s Annotated Bible� seems more a schoolyard taunting of the Bible rather than a serious rebuttal. I, admittedly, only glanced at certain parts of the offered website; however, I found it to be more a juvenile celebration of how right the unbeliever is, and how stupid the Christian is, rather than a serious reference material of any kind.

I have looked at it too and have found it to be a superb tool to invoke when someone tells you flat out that there are no contradictions in the Bible. And rather than quote it to them, I would insist that they check it out for themselves. It never fails to amaze me how many people who claim biblical knowledge or just being Christian, have never cracked the cover of a Bible and have no clue as to what's in it beyond the bits and pieces they were fed by a cleric or Sunday school teacher.

Godless Wonder

I'm not that familiar with the SAB, but from what little looking I have done, it seemed a bit cursory at times. I rather like Dennis McKinsey's Biblical Errancy for it's sheer relentlessness. One day, I carelessly and naively decided I'd like to print the thing out and put it in a 3 ring binder. Three reams of paper, three ink cartridges and eight notebooks later, I have a full set. Just waiting for the day I drop that stack at the feet of some poor JW who gives me the Biblical inerrancy schtick. "Oh, inerrant? Then I shouldn't have a notebook filled with Bible errors, should I? And I certainly shouldn't have eight notebooks filled with Bible errors . . . " Whump!