aa5874

Again, a Load of BS. As soon as people abandon the human Jesus experiment then only the Myth would be left--like Apollo and Zeus.

HJers are coming to the realization that they are really no different to Creationist.

The Creationists believe Adam and Even were human although created by God and HJers believe Jesus was human even though he was produced by the Holy Ghost in the Bible.

maryhelena

Ah, I see that HJ has been replaced by "human Jesus"...

And that idea, a "human Jesus", a flesh and blood Jesus, is not an idea that will lie down dead any day soon. Wishful thinking aside.....:devil3:

Toto

You have not presented any evidence to show that these texts are historical evidence. The mere lack of supernatural elements does not turn a text into history.

Why do you keep making this mistake?

Horatio Parker

I would argue that awareness of the relevant history ie lack of evidence for HJ is shifting the ground as we speak.

Your points are further down the MJ road. First there has to be serious consideration of the non-HJ hypothesis.

Sheshbazzar

Participants in this forum are generally concerned with such matters.
My life experience and countless conversations regarding religious subjects and beliefs have taught me that to most people I have encountered, 'believer' and unbeliever alike, such arguments and definite positions are quite irrelevant to their perspective on religion or the conduct of their daily lives.
The most religious are mostly content to confine themselves to being defensive of a relatively small terratory defined by memorised 'proof texts' and participation in their sects ativities.
Even most of these have very limited knowledge of their Bible's total content, or any proficiency in the original languages.
The non-believers and agnostics for the most part, reveal themselves to be quite unconcerned as to whether there ever was a real flesh and blood Jebus, such concerns for all parties, in the main, being as irrelavant to their daily lives and practices, as the question of whether there ever was a real flesh and blood Easter bunny.
Even if it it were possible to persuade my Christian family members and aquaintances that the Jebus presented within their Bible's is totally fictional, it wouldn't shake their beliefs nor change their practices in the least.
To them it is what Jebus, and 'confessing belief in Jebus' and getting -others- to 'confess Jebus' represents, that is the principal thing.
(And I know that a good many already realise that fact. Neither their belief in their Jebus, nor their belief in Santa, or 'Uncle Sam' require that the actual personage ever existed as a real historical figure.)
It is simply regarded as socially impolite to question the existence or reality of these cult figures, or to resist that social pressure to conformity brought to bear under these iconic cult figure names. To do otherwise one becomes a 'Painted Bird'.

Horatio Parker

But we do live in our heads. The ignorance or denial of that reality is what leads people to delude themselves that the Jesus they create is flesh and blood. Because they believe that the only reality is a physical reality.

maryhelena

Been there done that - all of 30 years ago...and gave that theory short shift....

maryhelena

Ah - but the young'uns are not so quick to conform to their parents theological views. I never got my daughter to think these things through - but one of my grandsons has seen the movie Zeitgeist - and no more HJ for him....(I've not seen the movie but have tried to tell him there is more to the ahistoricist position than Acharya S ......)

maryhelena

Yes, of course - there is more to living than our physical reality. But that intellectual world we create can't function without our two feet set down squarely on terra-firma. We need both 'worlds'. The new 'earth' and the new 'heaven'.......

Horatio Parker

I would argue that of the two worlds the intelligible is far more important. Because without the (divine) gift of consciousness, discernment, judgement and understanding, there is no awareness of a physical world.