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Old 03-04-2004, 09:03 AM   #21
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Originally posted by Starboy
So unless we are redefining the english language in order for atheists to call ourselves spiritual I would say that a spiritual atheist is an oxymoron.
An atheist is merely one who lacks belief in god(s). You can disbelieve in gods and still believe in souls and the supernatural, like psychics and such. I know it's uncommon, but it's possible.

A materialist is one who rejects all things supernatural. Since god is supernatural, all materialists are atheists.

The vast bulk of atheists are materalists, but it is not strictly necessary that they be. I personally know one spiritual atheist, who is not a materialist. But we're working on her.

A spiritual atheist is just uncommon: a spiritual materialist is the oxymoron.
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Old 03-04-2004, 11:56 AM   #22
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A true athiest is as bad as a religious zealot--they are so convinced they know the truth that even if hard evidence did exist for a god or soul or netherworld or what have you, they would find a way to convince themselves it was false.
So someone who rejects gods, souls and hells because they are supernatural claims without evidence, are as ignorant as religious zealots?
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Old 03-04-2004, 01:19 PM   #23
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Originally posted by Yahzi
An atheist is merely one who lacks belief in god(s). You can disbelieve in gods and still believe in souls and the supernatural, like psychics and such...A spiritual atheist is just uncommon: a spiritual materialist is the oxymoron.
I would agree with most of Yahzi's post, but I'm not so sure about the uncommon bit. I know several people who fall into the atheist category but believe in other forms of the supernatural.

I live in a particularly godless part of the UK, so I wonder if people are more likely to interpret experiences, which would normally be seen as "the hand of god" in more religious communities, as psychic phenomena. There seems to be no shortage of victims/clients for psychics and mediums in the area, or people willing to entertain other wacky beliefs.

I've found that, of the people I've met who self-identify as atheists (and I have no reason to doubt them), it is actually the minority who are materialists.

It is quite common to hear people say, "I don't believe there's a god, but I don't think this is all there is." or some variation of this.

They're not materialists, a lot of them probably don't indulge in logically rigorous analysis of their beliefs, but by the most basic definition, that of lacking belief in god, I would argue that they are atheists.

Adding materialist, rationalist or any other requirements into the definition of atheism seems to be an unnecessarily divisive detour into the 'no true Scotsman' territory so beloved by the religiously intolerant.
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