Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The Dagda · 12-19-2009, 07:36 AM

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Originally Posted by Larkin31

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

Just type in zombie Jesus gospels into google.

HAHA

see above

kcdad · 12-19-2009, 08:01 AM

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bacht;
We all know that by the 4th C the Catholic church had developed enough to become officially supported by the Roman state.

This is a rather simplified version. The Romans co-opted the early church killing most of the original followers of the teachings of Jesus. Those who were left transformed the church into a quasi-civil religion adopting Roman and Greek rituals, traditions and beliefs. It wasn't so much the Roman State that supported the Church as vice versa.

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We also know that Judaism claims to have started with Moses, who may have been completely mythical.

You are confusing The nation of Israel with Judaism, which is a common and forgivable error. Judaism begins with the end of the Babylonian exile around 500 BCE. The Kingdom of Judah began in the 900 BCE century with the breakup of David's Kingdom into Israel and Judah. Moses, if he ever really existed, is another 600 years before that.

kcdad · 12-19-2009, 08:07 AM

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Originally Posted by bacht

If Jesus was truly divine then he could change/ignore the regular behaviour of matter and energy.

I guess this where I don't understand the mysticism of fundamentalists and literalists... it isn't a Marvel Comic.

If there is a god and it has established laws for existence, i.e. physics, then how can that same deity operate outside of those laws? Laws are not something that can be broken. They can be circumvented but they can not be changed. Those who claim god can walk on water or change elemental natures think that the universe is based on rules, not laws.

No deity can stop the sun in the sky, no deity can change the surface tension of water, or the coefficient of acceleration to falling bodies... or whatever. All powerful can not mean erratic and capricious. It must mean consistent, regular and predictable.

kcdad · 12-19-2009, 08:09 AM

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Originally Posted by bacht

Unknown, but obvious candidates would be Peter/Cephas, James the Just or Paul.

James the Just... the brother of this nonexistent myth?

kcdad · 12-19-2009, 08:11 AM

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Originally Posted by aa5874

And further, the Egyptians worshiped animals as Gods.

and we worship cars and women with fake breasts...

kcdad · 12-19-2009, 08:18 AM

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Originally Posted by Larkin31

500 raised corpses? What is that from?

The tendency of Middle Eastern people to exaggerate and metaphorize their language...

1000 means almost every one.

so 500 means about half the people...

The reference is to how many of the spiritually or politically dead or stagnant were "raised" from their deaths into new faith and action... this event must have had profound effects on those that had heard Jesus.
The proof, of course, is that in only 30 years their growing rebellion against Rome would bring down the destruction of Jerusalem.

The Dagda · 12-19-2009, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcdad

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

500 raised corpses? What is that from?

The tendency of Middle Eastern people to exaggerate and metaphorize their language...

1000 means almost every one.

so 500 means about half the people...

The reference is to how many of the spiritually or politically dead or stagnant were "raised" from their deaths into new faith and action... this event must have had profound effects on those that had heard Jesus.
The proof, of course, is that in only 30 years their growing rebellion against Rome would bring down the destruction of Jerusalem.

That's proof only of the Jews rebellious nature and aptness to sow sedition etc.

Proof would be an impartial historical record of the actual time documenting such an event. Other wise it's pretty much Chinese whispers.

kcdad · 12-19-2009, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcdad

The tendency of Middle Eastern people to exaggerate and metaphorize their language...

1000 means almost every one.

so 500 means about half the people...

The reference is to how many of the spiritually or politically dead or stagnant were "raised" from their deaths into new faith and action... this event must have had profound effects on those that had heard Jesus.
The proof, of course, is that in only 30 years their growing rebellion against Rome would bring down the destruction of Jerusalem.

That's proof only of the Jews rebellious nature and aptness to sow sedition etc.

Proof would be an impartial historical record of the actual time documenting such an event. Other wise it's pretty much Chinese whispers.

I am sure Fox News has some report on it...

aa5874 · 12-19-2009, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcdad

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larkin31

500 raised corpses? What is that from?

The tendency of Middle Eastern people to exaggerate and metaphorize their language...

1000 means almost every one.

so 500 means about half the people...

The reference is to how many of the spiritually or politically dead or stagnant were "raised" from their deaths into new faith and action... this event must have had profound effects on those that had heard Jesus.
The proof, of course, is that in only 30 years their growing rebellion against Rome would bring down the destruction of Jerusalem.

So what does 6 hundred thousand mean?

Ex 12:37 -

Quote:

And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand on foot that were men, beside children.

And why did Jesus in the NT feed 5000 men and then feed 4000 men afterwards in a separate incident?

Something may be wrong with your counting?

Larkin31 · 12-19-2009, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcdad

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dagda

That's proof only of the Jews rebellious nature and aptness to sow sedition etc.

Proof would be an impartial historical record of the actual time documenting such an event. Other wise it's pretty much Chinese whispers.

I am sure Fox News has some report on it...

Is there no middle ground between "proof" (not likely from records 2100 years old ) and "Chinese whispers"?

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