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Old 10-31-2007, 09:50 AM   #291
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Fundies always overlook that part, don't they?
How do you figure that? They were invaded easily by a foreign power. Why is this invasion not a logical result of the 10 plagues?
Why assume that the 10 plagues were somehow involved ?
10 plagues for which incidentally we have no archaeological evidence and no historical evidence other than what was written in the Bible ,which is itself unsupported by corroborative evidence of any sort .

Why is this invasion not the logical result of being beaten in a war by a a)more numerous foe b) a better trained foe c) a foe with better tactics/generals or c) a foe with better weapons or d) all or any combination of the above ?
Are you saying that every winning army has to automatically rely on some supernaturally created illness or famine to win ?
Hitler's Germany seemed to be able to manage some pretty sucessful invasions in the early years of WW2 were they the result of supernatural "plagues" among their opponents too ?
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Old 10-31-2007, 10:08 AM   #292
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Fundies always overlook that part, don't they?
How do you figure that? They were invaded easily by a foreign power. Why is this invasion not a logical result of the 10 plagues?
And when was this supposed "invasion".
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Old 10-31-2007, 10:22 AM   #293
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Fundies always overlook that part, don't they?
How do you figure that? They were invaded easily by a foreign power. Why is this invasion not a logical result of the 10 plagues?
And how do you figure it is? Where's your evidence?
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Old 10-31-2007, 10:47 AM   #294
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How do you figure that? They were invaded easily by a foreign power. Why is this invasion not a logical result of the 10 plagues?
And how do you figure it is? Where's your evidence?
afdave's logic is probably that the plagues took place in the reign of Dudimose and shortly afterwards the Hyksos invaded and found no opposition, the plagues having weakened the Egyptians.

The evidence however is that the Hyksos were already in Egypt, ie there was no "invasion", but had become local powers (having infiltrated earlier, just as the Hebrews were supposed to have done). The weakness of the 13th dynasty was a long drawn out process of decay over many decades. So, no invasion just a development of power as the home power weakened. Nothing to suggest god's plagues had anything to do with it.


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Old 10-31-2007, 11:22 AM   #295
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The Hyksos "Invasion" seems to be a literary creation of the third century BC writer, Manetho. Manetho was as far separated in history from the events he described as we are from Justinian I. To be sure, the Egyptian reaction to a foreign dynasty was swift and sure. For 4 centuries after Ahmose I they dominated Canaan and maintained a base at Beth Shean and border forts along the approaches.

Moreover, any attempt to place any sort of "exodus" prior to 1200 BC runs into the problem of the Amarna records which give us a pretty solid idea of political conditions in Canaan under Egyptian hegemony. The Amarna tablets do not include any reference to "Hebrews."
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Old 10-31-2007, 11:31 AM   #296
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Fundies always overlook that part, don't they?
How do you figure that? They were invaded easily by a foreign power. Why is this invasion not a logical result of the 10 plagues?
I remember the 10 plagues that came over Iraq before the U.S. invasion, I guess the U.S. never could have dethroned Saddam Hussein if the frogs had not come first and Tigris turned to blood.
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Old 10-31-2007, 11:36 AM   #297
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Bush is 10 plagues all by himself.
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Old 10-31-2007, 12:07 PM   #298
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Not only that, but if the ten plagues
occured, that would have been the end of Egypt as a dominant power in the Middle East, and that did not happen.
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Fundies always overlook that part, don't they?
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How do you figure that? They were invaded easily by a foreign power.
Which foreign power, which year, and what was the outcome of the invasion?

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Originally Posted by afdave
Why is this invasion not a logical result of the 10 plagues?
Because, as any competent historian would tell you, no powerful country has ever existed that did not get attacked many times. The Roman Empire is a good example. Many enemies unsuccessfully attacked Rome for centuries. The strength of the Roman Empire did not deter them.

What do you mean by "easily"? Any military force of any size can easily attack another military force. The success of such encounters is another matter.

If the Ten Plagues occured, they would have been the most extraordinary news events in all of the civilized world. Word of them would have spread rapidly to areas far away from Egypt via travelers, traders, and visitors. Suspense would have mounted as each plague occured, increasing interest. Many historians would recorded news of the events by means of written records and archaeological methods.

Of course, it is an aburd notion that God chose Abraham and his descendents as his chosen people and turned his back on everyone else in the world for thousands of years. Chosen for what, may I ask?
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Old 10-31-2007, 02:44 PM   #299
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The solution to plagues is clear, but does take diligence and consistency--

Floss.
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Old 11-01-2007, 09:37 AM   #300
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Still waiting for the details on that "invasion."

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