Magdlyn

Apikorus, Solitary Man and Toto, thanks for the links! I seem to have stumbled on a hot topic.

spin

Philo was an Alexandrian Jew who wrote Jewish tracts in Greek with a Platonic tinge to them. No-one I know of doubts his being a Jew. Trypho (if he existed, and indications are scant but positive) was referred to in a long work by Justin Martyr ("Contra Trypho") and was apparently a Jewish elder in Ephesus.

But that is something for you to investigate. I have seen no indicators in the archaeology.

(The Essenes had nothing to do with the DSS, despite current beliefs. The leaders of the DSS community were active priests and the Essenes were excluded from the temple.)

As I said, there were actively two distinct dialects of Hebrew used. Yet another dialect was found among the documents from the Bar Kochba revolt. Hebrew was spoken. It wasn't a book language.

There is a lot of material in the gospels which on analysis don't appear to contain any factual basis, the temptation material, the garden of Gethsemane, Jesus's consolation of the good thief, etc. Then again some of the material may have been represented simplistically, leading to wrong implications. I don't know.

"I don't know" is a good response. If you can get beyond it, then that would be better. ("Contact a Samaritan" is the best advice I can give for you to get access to Samaritan religious literature.)


spin

Magdlyn

If you don't know, why not just skip quoting that particular question, rather than giving a non-answer. I don't expect you or anyone to have all the answers.

Thanks. But you are saying "Jew," when that term is undefined. I am trying to define it. That is what the links the others cited provided, books that are trying to find out when "Judaean" ceased to be only an ethnic term and began to be used as a religious term as well, or instead. See the difference?

I was asking, not for a description of who Philo and Trypho were (I knew that, altho I thought Trypho was a fictional foil) but what you think they said that defined "Judaean" religious, as opposed to Judaean ethnic, thought/practice for their time.

spin

The people referred to were not in Judea. Obviously it wasn't just a geographical term.

I try to deal with the evidence, not with what people write about it. (See the difference?) And I have a fair knowledge of the evidence.

How do you separate religious from cultural aspects of an ethnos?? The issue of course would have got further clouded by the fact that ethnic Jews proselytized among the gentiles and the powers that were made laws first forbidding circumcision, then, relaxing this law, allowing circumcision only to sons of Jews (under Antoninus Pius and reaffirmed by Septimius Severus).


spin

Solitary Man

Just like there were Romans in the provinces. Yes, it is a geographic term. Whether it can be extended to something beyond that we can discuss it, but ultimately, it is a geographic term.

Were Christians Romans?

spin

If people had lived in places for several generations the term applied to them was no longer geographical. Greeks in Magna Grecia were still Greeks. Just as Celts in Anatolia were as Celt as Celts in what is now France. Strict geographical terminology doesn't allow this. Plainly we are dealing with ethno-geographical terminology accompanied with implied cultural traits which include religion.

When you ask a question and expect an answer you should include sufficient material to make the question's scope, purpose and relevance transparent.


spin

Magdlyn

Well, that is the most on topic and helpful thing you have said yet.

spin

Why didn't you read what I said before rather than read past it?

Chili

You may not like this Magdlyn but Galileans were purgatorians and they do not mix with Jews (or Catholics for that matter). They are what we know as charismatics or holy rollers of some sort who cannot keep their hands off of poor Jews (they always want to zap somebody), nor can they communicate with them . . . or living water would be no different than just water. That is what the woman at the well parable is all about, yet I like her inquisitive mind to prove that this difference is real but not totally foreign to her.

Nazareth was in Galilee where Mary is from to say that she descended from heaven to be the gate of paradise in Galilea, which is Nazareth and therefore only Nazoreans will make it to heaven where she is the quality of distinction . . . but no good as Jew or heaven and earth would be the same.

Mary was not Jewish because here are no temples where she was from. She was sinless and and never part of Judaism or there would be no difference between Judeans and Samarians.

Magdlyn

Why, I did, old bean. And commented on much of it. I just thought the above comment was helpful as a summation of a wide ranging bunch of info, as opposed to some sarcastic advice such as "look it up yourself, that's your problem, ask the [dead] writer."

I'm not averse to research. But I am asking for factual input here, as that is the purpose of the forum. I value your insight and knowledge base, but take offense at the unneeded sarcasm and condescension.