Freethought & Rationalism Archive

AtheistVirus · 05-16-2008, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clivedurdle

When do you get elsewhere people telling you what it says and having huge institutions telling you what the party line is?

Exactly, just this gives validity to go negative on the probability...you just have to make parallels and go outside the fallacious religious symbolic field of inherent legitimacy.

Clivedurdle · 05-16-2008, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Roman execution records

Sorry?

Further details please!

Vampyroteuthis · 05-16-2008, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clivedurdle

Quote:

Roman execution records

Sorry?

Further details please!

I think those were shredded with the Enron docs.

Toto · 05-16-2008, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AtheistVirus

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

For most purposes, the human Jesus theory is enough to defeat the idea that Jesus was the fleshy part of the trinity who got himself born of a virgin and crucified under Pilate, then rose from the dead and sits at the right hand of God.

I'm not interested in biases and pandering, if there is already enough direct and circumstantial evidence of Jesus's nonexistence why not say "probably didn't exist" instead of "probably did exist", negative probability is more solid than positive, isn't it?

I guess it just comes down to the cultural fact that if you say Jesus never existed, the person you are talking to may take it as a DIRECT personal attack on the very basis of their being - much more so than saying that God doesn't exist. Then their brain will go into defensive overdrive mode and whatever hope you had of communicating will be gone.

That's just my experience.

Clivedurdle · 05-16-2008, 02:30 PM

Children manage to survive learning Santa doesn't exist, so why the adult temper tantrum about this?

Vampyroteuthis · 05-16-2008, 02:35 PM

Toto, I agree.

Gamer4Fire · 05-16-2008, 04:46 PM

I thought that Jesus was such a popular name at that time that there were hundreds of Jesus'. Just pick one who happened to be a carpenter.

Mal Malenkirk · 05-16-2008, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AtheistVirus

Why does Dawkins always say that Jesus probably existed, he always uses that wording instead simply saying, "let's pretend he existed, than..." or "Jesus probably didn't exist"

Has he read this-
http://www.rationalrevolution.net/ar...th_history.htm

It's a good case but it's not the consensus as of yet.

Since this isn't even his field, why should he even bother with it until there is a consensus amongst scholars who actually study this issue?

I got to say, I'm fairly sympathetic to the mythical Jesus idea, but you just sound like a sport fan shouting : ''How can you doubt the Sox will win the world series!'' Hey, they have a good team but I'm not betting the farm until the other teams ave been eliminated.

DBT · 05-16-2008, 08:47 PM

I think there's a reasonable possibility that the Jesus myth was based on a charismatic preacher going by the name of Yeshua Ben Yoseph. There is not much to go on but considering Paul/Saul was a near contemporary and Christianity was already getting established by word of mouth, it seems unlikely that there ws no basis whatsoever for the movement.

purple_kathryn · 05-17-2008, 02:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.F. Gaul

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vampyroteuthis

I think I missed the announcement proclaiming jebus was a real person. Can you send me a pic or something?

It's Jesus. Yay!

I am most impressed by his perfect, bright white teeth.

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05-16-2008, 02:30 PM	#15
Clivedurdle Contributor Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: London UK Posts: 16,024	Children manage to survive learning Santa doesn't exist, so why the adult temper tantrum about this?

05-16-2008, 02:35 PM	#16
Vampyroteuthis Contributor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 14,915	Toto, I agree.

05-16-2008, 04:46 PM	#17
Gamer4Fire Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: NAS Atlanta Posts: 2,104	I thought that Jesus was such a popular name at that time that there were hundreds of Jesus'. Just pick one who happened to be a carpenter.

05-16-2008, 08:47 PM	#19
DBT Contributor Join Date: May 2003 Location: ɹǝpunuʍop puɐן ǝɥʇ Posts: 17,906	I think there's a reasonable possibility that the Jesus myth was based on a charismatic preacher going by the name of Yeshua Ben Yoseph. There is not much to go on but considering Paul/Saul was a near contemporary and Christianity was already getting established by word of mouth, it seems unlikely that there ws no basis whatsoever for the movement.

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