Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Jo · 09-20-2008, 08:14 AM

Moved from MF&P to ~E~

premjan · 09-20-2008, 09:58 AM

It isn't so simple as social programming, for instance many animals (and even humans though perhaps to a somewhat smaller extent) are capable of detecting their kin by smell. Even humans have some limited ability to distinguish immuno-compatible and incompatible mates.

Fayzal Mahamed · 09-20-2008, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

It isn't so simple as social programming, for instance many animals (and even humans though perhaps to a somewhat smaller extent) are capable of detecting their kin by smell. Even humans have some limited ability to distinguish immuno-compatible and incompatible mates.

From my personal experience with animals I find your above statement to be palpably false.

I think you are sucking such facts out of a thumb! Please provide us with an authentic study by scientist to justify such claims (both in connection with animals and human beings).

Fayzal

premjan · 09-20-2008, 11:15 AM

Look it up yourself - there are tons of studies on it e.g. the vomeronasal organ.

nj_heathens · 09-20-2008, 11:24 AM

Fayzal, aren't you the father who masturbates his disabled son?

Fayzal Mahamed · 09-20-2008, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

Look it up yourself - there are tons of studies on it e.g. the vomeronasal organ.

I've looked it up and non of the studies suggest your conclusion.

Fayzal

premjan · 09-20-2008, 12:47 PM

http://www.dailynexus.com/article.php?a=13315
nurture-only
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=15014908
biological
http://www.biologynews.net/archives/...n_monkeys.html
in monkeys
http://biblioteca.universia.net/html.../32975064.html
in fish

mrunicycler · 09-20-2008, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fayzal Mahamed

...
Also where is the harm when a widow decides to sleep with her eldest son to satisfy her sexually when she may have a difficult time meeting other men. Is it not psychologically better for the entire family if a woman in such a predicament is "satisfied".

Where is the harm?

I'll offer exhibit 1a) the son's psychological health.

Quote:

...

We humans tend to conjure a romantic image of animal relationship similar to humans. I can guarantee you that if you take a female lion and remove it when it is young from its parents and re-introduce this lioness to her father say after a year or so, the father lion will commit "incest" with his daughter lioness if he has no other option for his sexual desires.

Fayzal

You can guarantee this? Does that mean you're a biologist/zoologist who's published peer reviewed material on the subject?

If so, can I have the links?

I'll also accept peer reviewed material that you've come across, but didn't publish yourself.

premjan · 09-20-2008, 08:46 PM

My guess is Fayzal is more likely to offer anecdotal evidence from his personal experience.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...4f11edd4e2177c
Animals do sometimes commit incest but seem to avoid it in the vast majority of circumstances.

mrunicycler · 09-21-2008, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by premjan

My guess is Fayzal is more likely to offer anecdotal evidence from his personal experience.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...4f11edd4e2177c
Animals do sometimes commit incest but seem to avoid it in the vast majority of circumstances.

Even so, he's got quite a long way to go to get from sparrows inbreeding to his claim that large cats do so (keeping in mind that your article says, ~'never between father-daughter', which is exactly what his example describes), and then reaching the level of it being acceptable for humans to do so.

Sparrows, if I'm not mistaken, vomit their food into their baby's mouths. Just because they do so doesn't mean I'm going to argue that my wife should feed our baby that way, as well.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

09-20-2008, 08:14 AM	#21
Jo System Overlord Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: New Zealand twitter.com/Alcyonian Posts: 23,659	Moved from MF&P to ~E~

09-20-2008, 09:58 AM	#22
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	It isn't so simple as social programming, for instance many animals (and even humans though perhaps to a somewhat smaller extent) are capable of detecting their kin by smell. Even humans have some limited ability to distinguish immuno-compatible and incompatible mates.

09-20-2008, 11:15 AM	#24
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	Look it up yourself - there are tons of studies on it e.g. the vomeronasal organ.

09-20-2008, 11:24 AM	#25
nj_heathens Regular Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Ewing, NJ Posts: 447	Fayzal, aren't you the father who masturbates his disabled son?

09-20-2008, 12:47 PM	#27
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	http://www.dailynexus.com/article.php?a=13315 nurture-only http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=15014908 biological http://www.biologynews.net/archives/...n_monkeys.html in monkeys http://biblioteca.universia.net/html.../32975064.html in fish

09-20-2008, 08:46 PM	#29
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	My guess is Fayzal is more likely to offer anecdotal evidence from his personal experience. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...4f11edd4e2177c Animals do sometimes commit incest but seem to avoid it in the vast majority of circumstances.

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.