Toto

I don't think so. Illnesses were associated with sin fairly uniformly.

That was ritual cleanliness, not sterility.


Modern people like to claim that the Bible is rational, not just silly superstitions. In fact, some traditions probably helped the survival of the society, but for reasons unrelated to their purpose.

Traditional concepts of contagion

Toto

Source?

outhouse

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_Mark

Mark wrote primarily for an audience of gentile Greek-speaking residents of the Roman Empire: Jewish traditions are explained, clearly for the benefit of non-Jews


That takes care of Roman authors/scribes



http://www.awesomestories.com/movies...christ_ch2.htm

When Herod died, in 4 BC - his long-sought tomb was finally located in May of 2007 - Roman oppression of the Jews worsened dramatically. By 6 AD, Judea was a Roman province where the tax burden imposed on the Jews became nearly unbearable.

Toto

Ahem. Your "source" is the summary of a movie that embodies Christian mythology. The footnote to your quote does not exactly support your conclusion:

http://www.livius.org/ja-jn/jewish_wars/jwar02.html

The pagan symbols on the coins seem to be the basis of the revolt, not the high taxes.

DCHindley

Are you sure about that?

See if you can get your hands upon a copy of Fabian Udoh's To Caesar What Is Caesar's: Tribute, Taxes, and Imperial Administration in Early Roman Palestine 63 B.C.E to 70 C.E. (or via: amazon.co.uk) (2006). It will likely be available in a decently stocked university library. I actually got a copy of his Doctoral Dissertation (Duke, 1996), upon which the book is based, via inter-library loan.

Contents
Preface and Acknowledgments ix
Abbreviations xi
Introduction 1
1 Roman Tribute in Jewish Palestine
under Pompey (63-47 b.c.e.) 9

Cicero, Dio Cassius, and Appian 12
Cicero 12
Dio Cassius 17
Appian 18
Tribute and Exactions 22
Conclusion 30

2 Caesar's Favors (47-44 b.c.e.) 31

Tribute: For the City of Jerusalem, and for the City of Joppa 41
Tribute for the City of Joppa 45
Tribute for the City of Jerusalem 48
Further Reductions, Collection 52
Local Taxes 57
Territorial Grants: Joppa, "The Villages in the Great Plain,"
and Lydda 60
The Senate, Joppa, and the Plain of Sharon 68
Joppa, "The Villages in the Great Plain," and Lydda 71
Grants of Freedom: Billeting, Military Service,
and Molestation 75
Billeting 76
Military Service 79
Molestation: Angareia, the Temple Tax 82

3 Cassius and Antony in the East (43-40 b.c.e.) 100

Cassius in Syria (43-42 b.c.e.) 101
After Philippi: Antony and the Jewish State (42-31 b.c.e.) 108

4 Herodian Taxation (37 b.c.e.-4 b.c.e.) 113

The Herods and Roman Tribute 190
Roman Tribute and the Status of Judea 122
Appian's Bell. civ. 5.75 and Herod's Appointment 137
A King's Accounting 143
Herod's Taxes 159
Land and Property Taxes 162
The "Head Tax" 164
Tolls and Duties on Goods in Transit 171
Sales Taxes 175
House Tax 177
Epilogue 180

5 Taxation of Judea under the Governors 207

Judea and the Provincial Census 208
Judea and Provincial Taxes 219
Tributum Soli 221
Tributum Capitis 223
Other Taxes and the System of Collection 238
Conclusions 241

6 Tithes in the Second Temple Period 244

Tithes: For Priests or for Levites? 245
Biblical Laws and Postexilic Harmonizations 245
"First Tithes" to Priests and to Levites 248
Num 18:21-32; Lev 27:30-33 in Ezra/Nehemiah's
Restoration 258
Centralized Collection 263
Offered also to Individual Priests and Levites 273
Tithes of Livestock 275
Summary and Conclusion 277

Epilogue 279
Bibliography 289

DCHindley

The temple tax shekels also bore pagan images (originally minted in Tyre). Keep in mind that the Roman poll tax was one denarius (= one silver drachma, 1/4 of a shekel used to pay temple tax), and probably only covered the cost of conducting it. The temple authority, including the HP and the land still under its control (which was alotted to familys based on long tradition) would now be subject to the Roman prefect.

Romans tended to NOT interfere with the management of land of those temples under their authority (although they occasionally confiscated some of it if the revenues seemed to exceed the amounts required to maintain the temple building and the priests, to prevent the temples from influencing politics). Only occupants of land under temple control were subject to tithes.

Royal land and land under control of elites leased the land to tenant farmers who paid "in kind" (that is, in grain and produce). As elites were generally exempt from Roman land taxes, the rents would not change that much. There is no evidence that the rent charged for royal land changed that much under Roman control from what the Herods charged before 6 CE.

I think it was the fact that the Roman prefect, as the local representative of the Emperor, would be in ultimate control of temple policy, rather than the HP, who was God's representative.

DCH

outhouse

Ill see if I can get that.



But im sure.

Recent scholarships have overturned that. But I use the term overturned loosely. Crossen, Meyers, Borg, Reed. All claim a very oppressed poverty stricken Galilee. While others, [names on the tip of my toungue] say it wasnt so impoverished.


I dont think its a dead split, but scholarships are split on this.

outhouse

You best check a few records, the fall of the temple was over taxation, and the war in Galilee when Joshua was a child was over taxes.


The thing is both wars were started knowing full well they had no chance at winning. They knew it was suicide, but fought anyway.

For oppressed people to do this, it had to be pretty bad.

Toto

Oppressed financially - or religious fanatics who thought g-d would rescue them?

A revolt of the impoverished revolutionary workers and peasants fits a Marxist paradigm, but it doesn't seem to fit the facts very well. If you study history, revolutions tend to happen when economic conditions are improving. People who are desperately poor don't have the energy to stage a revolt.

Toto

Please stop this random name dropping. If you claim that "recent scholarships" have come to a certain conclusion, you need an actual citation - name, publication, and the conclusion.