JoyJuice

A little help from those who read Greek given this argument from a poster in Christian Forums.

He claims that per the Greek Nestle-Aland NT, Luke 3:23 (HERE) that "Joseph was recognized as a legal son (and that would account for Mary being an heiress), but not an actual son according to the text."

He expounds: :huh:

and then this:It seems to be he is purposely mutilating the grammar here to apply the "as to the law" meant to descibe Jesus' relation to Joseph, and making the claim Jesus is the actual son of Heli, and Joseph in this blood genalogy does not apply.

Heres the forum starting at post #136

Thoughts?

Clouseau

N.B. Christian as defined by Satan.

Carry on.

JoeWallack

JW:

http://www.zhubert.com/word?word=%E1...&number=620416
[emphasis mine]

"Word Detail
Word/Inflected Form Lemma Part of Speech Lexical Entry
ἐνομίζετο (1) νομίζω (30) Verb (1) to follow, hold to, or practice what is customary; (2) to form an idea about, to consider, suppose or believe with some hesitation
Parsing 3rd Person Imperfect Passive Indicative Singular
Related Words None found.
Context in Luke 3:23 τριάκοντα ὢν υἱός ὡς ... Ἰωσὴφ τοῦ Ἠλὶ τοῦ
Strongs # 3543 properly, to do by law (usage), i.e. to accustom (passively, be usual); by extension, to deem or regard"


JW:
Note that the Source you refer to:

http://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineI...NTpdf/luc3.pdf

is an Interlinear which is giving the linear ROOT word:

"Strongs # 3543 properly, to do by law (usage), i.e. to accustom (passively, be usual); by extension, to deem or regard"

What the offending word means in any one place is dependent on Parsing and Context. As you can see, the root has a Range of meaning. You need the Parsing and Context to help determine the specific meaning within the Range.

Here, the specific construction is 3rd Person (they). A translation of "as was supposed" fits the parsing as it is the "they" who are supposing. "As to the law" does not fit. The Context also supports "as was supposed" as 3rd parties thinking Jesus was the biological son of Joseph as opposed to the result of a virgin birth is understandable. "As to the law" has nothing in the surrounding context to support it.

The above is probably why I have never seen a Professional translation here of "as to the law".

I have to confess though that I find the Interlinear translation "was-LAWizED"
fascinating. But note that over to the right they still give an English translation of "as was supposed".

Thanks for mentioning this as I will be watching ChristianForums closely to see if anyone there points all this out before Jesus SOON returns.



Joseph

TRANSLATOR, n.
One who enables two persons of different languages to understand each other by repeating to each what it would have been to the translator's advantage for the other to have said.

http://www.errancywiki.com/index.php/Main_Page

ClassicsFiend

JoyJuice:

That guy is full of it. ενομιζετο just means "he was thought or supposed." (3rd sg impf m/p ind). The verb means "believe" in Smyth's Greek Grammar. There are alternate definitions such as "to have as a custom," but that's about as strongly legalistic as the word gets. You can check the online LSJ (giant Greek dictionary) at perseus.tufts.edu if you want to know more.

Every time I see that verb it has to do with thinking or supposing, and trying to turn it into a definite legal term and warping the words around to do so is pretty silly. It's clear that Ιωσεφ του Ηλι του Μαθθατ' etc. etc. is just part of a string of descent and there isn't anything special about Heli.

Good luck!

JoyJuice

Thanks guys, several people have taken him to task for his deception all for the faith.