reniaa

i'm sorry but I don't buy it! at no point during the verse does it say they always break, just thats why men put new wine into new wineskin. You are reaching here.

By the way guys if an arguement is weak it is weak and apologetics is only a word to describe people who are doing same as you but from the opposite point of view,

As with above arguement I think the poster makes a very weak case arguing innerancy were there is none just a description of a well-known practise to emphasise a metaphor.

Johnny Skeptic

Actually, it is not up to skeptics to reasonably prove that the Bible is inerrant. It is up to inerantists to reasonably prove that the Bible is inerrant.

reniaa

your talking innerancy were it is but then were it is not.

Did men put new wine in new wineskins in those days to avoid breakages? Yesw course they did it was a common practise because in those time old wineskins broke. this is provable.

thats all the bible is saying it's not saying old wineskins always break just a metaphor using a common practise as an example.

aa5874

The Kennedy assasination is not really a problem, it is one of the most conspicuous piece of information that helps to contradict the history of Jesus.

Everyone who sees the video would see the actual assasination, regardless of your perspective, all would say the same thing, Kenedy was assasinated. Whether you were Republican, Democrat, Jew, Indendent, Christian, Muslim, Atheist and you were there or saw the video, you would say Kenedy was assasinated.

However, Jesus the son of God, who had thousands of followers, was crucified and only two so-called followers wrote that it happened. None of the thousands of followers ever wrote anything about the crucifixion or simply wrote down the date.

reniaa

And of course in jesus's day everyone could write, had video camera's, TV crews, Typewriters, biro pens and paper at hand for everyone.

You cannot compare a modern event with a pre-industrial one unless you take into account the complete differences of culture and apportunities for the action that can easily be done now but certainly not then! When writing was a luxury for very few, and scribes had to be paid for, even the materials were rare. So what people wrote and did were very much more thought about than they are now.

Ben C Smith

Every now and then a magazine will claim that John Kennedy is still alive.

Ben.

Doddy

One would have expected the roman officials to write things down at least, rather than just religiously motivated so-called followers. Then again, maybe it was a massive conspiracy and cover-up!

DFrechetteNH

My EXACT point! If we had all the technology to record an event such as a presidential assasination and it is still THE go to case for what history says and what really happened are very different. How can ANYTHING in the bible be trusted.

The Kennedy assasination is a synonym for conspiracy cover-up even with all the evidence so how can anyone trust a book written down decades after an event with no indepedent checking, no original documents, no complete manuscripts, no copies of copies of copies of copies of original manuscripts, edited by scribes who had no vowels or punctuation to work with and worst of all, had a bias toward the texts they were copying.

The Bible as with all ancient texts are a great glimpse into ancient western civilization just like the Illiad, The Odyssey, Beowulf and others. Enjoy the stories, take those moral lessons you like, discard the ones you don't. But, to take it seriously, how could you?

You don't believe Zeus blew Odysseus off course, do you? Or was it Poseiden? Maybe a little combination of a wild storm, inexperienced sailors (surely some of his original crew was lost in the war) and some wine.

If you don't believe a god did it, then why don't you believe it?

reniaa

Think what they had to write up about?

JC wasn't president Kennedy. At the time he was one of many annoying messiahs that popped up. his death! he was executed with lowly thiefs and it was put down to the jews responsibility by pontius pilate. Maybe it got mention on some papyrus but most of them were destroyed when the romans killed 1 million jews and sacked jerusalem not long after, the dead seas scrolls survived because they were taking by jew themselves and put in caves.

reniaa

The point of the bible is it is inspired of God and despite many critics on here they can't deny the bible does have archaeological back-up :- pontius pilate stone, herod great info, as well accurate info on how things were done. But this has all been said before and discounted by you lot as meaningless which I personally think lessens your arguements because the others stories don't have it and I would respect opinions more if they recognised at least the archaeological evidence for the bible secular as it is, even if they still disagreed.

Another point is do you realise your arguement actually backs up jesus being a real person? president kennedy (a real person and assassination) inspires loads of writing, the crap as well as accurate. So did jesus which argues in favour of a real event underneath it all as with kennedies assassination.

The fact is if you doubt any written evidence from however many different sources just because you didn't see the event with your own eyes, how can you believe anything happenned before your birth?

Or do you just doubt religious sources guys (this is to everyone) jesus was a religious figure so he inspired religious works both the accurate as well as the crap but kennedy was political figure so inspired political writings both accurate and crapola! Do you believe kennedy because it was political event guys rather than religious?

Is your default position to doubt all religious items by preference despite the similarities to other none religious event as in this case (kennedy and jesus) both inspired many writings?