Freethought & Rationalism Archive

show_no_mercy · 06-22-2006, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scartuna

You have the dementions wrong. The ark was 300 cubits by 50 cubits by 30 cubits tall, Gen. 6:15. A cubit is about 18 in. It also had 3 decks Gen 6:16. So the dementions are 450x75x45 feet. Each deck was 33,750 sq. ft. for a total of 101,250 sq. ft. of floor space, and 1,518,750 cubic feet. This makes about 8.5 times more room than you thought. One other interesting note about the arks dementions. These dementions perfectly balance the relationship between ark stability and economy of materials.

a WOODEN boat of that size would not stay afloat for long. Wood gets wet and buckles, and thus the ship would crumble under its own weight.

That's why wooden ships in recorded history only reached a certain size. To get bigger ships, you needed a material that didn't bend when it got wet: steel

Seriously, why haven't any creationists recreated Noah's Ark and set sail with it? Simply because the physics are impossible.

ETA: Oh yeah, I also added a website that gives a pretty good deconstruction of Noah's Ark. It was originally a post by an iidb member.

Here

ninewands · 06-22-2006, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsgutman

I am a new user, and an agnostic. Recently I got tangled in yet another annoying debate with a deist in regard to Noahs Ark. I have three main problems, and would like to know how one who believes the story to be true can reconcile them...
1. the ark measured 120 x 30 x 50, which is 180,000 cubic feet, how can that possibly fit the 1.875 million identified species in the world today
2. how were the animals dispersed after the flood?
3. what did the herbivores eat after the flood, and what did the predators stalk?

Actually, ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.users.bigpond.com/rdoolan/arksize.html

Genesis 6:15 in the Bible tells us the Ark's dimensions were at least 135 meters long (300 cubits), 22.5 meters wide (50 cubits), and 13.5 meters high (30 cubits). That's 450 feet long, 75 feet wide, and 45 feet high! It could have been larger because several larger-sized cubits were used. But the 45-centimeter (18-inch) cubit is long enough to show the enormous size of the Ark.

(A cubit was the length of a man's arm from fingertips to elbow.)

ETA: (or roughly 1518750 cubic feet)

... of course there is no archaeologically DOCUMENTED case of a boat that big EVER having been successfully built and sailed, and every recent attempt to build one that size has failed dismally as a result of the poor structural characteristics of wood for building enormous structures ... but I guess Noah could do anything since he was acting on GAWD's command and we ALL know GAWD can make ALL things possible ... just ask your neighborhood fundy. :devil3:

Donnmathan · 06-22-2006, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by llDayo

Or maybe a hurricane? We could challenge the top 8 creationists in the world to make the ark to the dimensions specified and then send them out into a category 5. If any of them survive, evolution becomes false :devil3:

Don't forget that it has to be made of the materials they had at hand AT THE TIME...so no iron, and definately no steel.

RidgeBe · 06-22-2006, 04:11 PM

By Biblical description, Noah’s ark was a barge, large enough to have fit within a football stadium. Barges are inherently unstable. Tugboat captains who guided lighters (barges that carried railroad freight cars) across upper New York Bay (a protected harbor) did not go out if there was more than a light chop because of the lighter’s instability. All wooden structure of this size would have had to have a multiplicity of cross braces to retain its shape thus reducing carrying capacity, not to mention ramps, which occupy a great deal of space, to connect one floor to another. There was no propulsion, no steering so, as anyone who has ever sailed knows, would leave the ark in the most vulnerable position in a body of water inundated by industrial strength rain pumping necessary to inundate the earth in the time allotted. Virtually every applicable law of physics would have to have been violated for the ark to survive.

fromdownunder · 06-22-2006, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FordPrefect

Yep, from Leviticus 11
3. `Whatever divides a hoof, thus making split hoofs, and chews the cud, among the animals, that you may eat.
7. and the pig, for though it divides the hoof, thus making a split hoof, it does not chew cud, it is unclean to you.

Correct, but Leviticus was the first time that "clean" and "unclean' were defined in the Bible. Makes a problem for Noah - he would not know which ones to take seven of.

Norm

igfm_spanky · 06-22-2006, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fromdownunder

Correct, but Leviticus was the first time that "clean" and "unclean' were defined in the Bible. Makes a problem for Noah - he would not know which ones to take seven of.

Norm

He could have used a system of trial and error. Let two animals onto the ark - fine. Then let a third on. At this point, if the animal is unclean, Noah will be struck by lightning for his disobedience.

scartuna · 06-22-2006, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sven

I see no reason to address this. In previous threads, you answered two, maybe three times, and then fled from the threads, to be not seen again for some weeks or months - until you contribute to another thread with similar ignorant posts.

You want to talk ignorant? How about this thread going on for two pages with an 850% error in the volume of the ark as recorded in the bible, and nobody noticed?! nobody checked? So i go get the facts and post them, and you call it ignorant?... I think you have it mixed up. And you wonder why i tire of posting.

scartuna · 06-22-2006, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by show_no_mercy

a WOODEN boat of that size would not stay afloat for long. Wood gets wet and buckles, and thus the ship would crumble under its own weight.

That's why wooden ships in recorded history only reached a certain size. To get bigger ships, you needed a material that didn't bend when it got wet: steel

Seriously, why haven't any creationists recreated Noah's Ark and set sail with it? Simply because the physics are impossible.

ETA: Oh yeah, I also added a website that gives a pretty good deconstruction of Noah's Ark. It was originally a post by an iidb member.

Here

you know your right about the wood getting wet, but God knew that too. Thats why He told Noah to coat the boat inside and out with tar, (pitch).Gen 6:14

06-22-2006, 08:22 PM

Really, because it makes no difference. I don't care if you claim there's one invisible god or three, there just aren't ANY. A smaller boat could be to your advantage in the physics of boats, though to your disadvantage in the physics of stuffing zillions of animals & their supplies for a few months into teeny spaces. Whatever.

I'm with the poster who was shocked to find that there are actually people who believe this particular fairy tale. It just is so far lost to sanity that it boggles the mind. I've been on this boad long enough to know they exist, but really, how can that story be believed by anyone smart enough to use a computer?

OneWayTraffic · 06-22-2006, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scartuna

you know your right about the wood getting wet, but God knew that too. Thats why He told Noah to coat the boat inside and out with tar, (pitch).Gen 6:14

And where did he get this 'pitch?'

Pitch is a 'fossil fuel' is it not? So where did it come from if not from the flood?

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06-22-2006, 04:11 PM	#44
RidgeBe Regular Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: New York, NY Posts: 353	By Biblical description, Noah’s ark was a barge, large enough to have fit within a football stadium. Barges are inherently unstable. Tugboat captains who guided lighters (barges that carried railroad freight cars) across upper New York Bay (a protected harbor) did not go out if there was more than a light chop because of the lighter’s instability. All wooden structure of this size would have had to have a multiplicity of cross braces to retain its shape thus reducing carrying capacity, not to mention ramps, which occupy a great deal of space, to connect one floor to another. There was no propulsion, no steering so, as anyone who has ever sailed knows, would leave the ark in the most vulnerable position in a body of water inundated by industrial strength rain pumping necessary to inundate the earth in the time allotted. Virtually every applicable law of physics would have to have been violated for the ark to survive.

06-22-2006, 08:22 PM	#49
cajela Guest Posts: n/a	Really, because it makes no difference. I don't care if you claim there's one invisible god or three, there just aren't ANY. A smaller boat could be to your advantage in the physics of boats, though to your disadvantage in the physics of stuffing zillions of animals & their supplies for a few months into teeny spaces. Whatever. I'm with the poster who was shocked to find that there are actually people who believe this particular fairy tale. It just is so far lost to sanity that it boggles the mind. I've been on this boad long enough to know they exist, but really, how can that story be believed by anyone smart enough to use a computer?

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