aa5874

Why would Mary lie about her "son'?

Luke 1.34-35&38, I see no good reason for Mary to lie about her "son" being the offspring of the Holy Ghost if Jesus actually was just human, unless of course, it was just fiction.

Ben C Smith

Where does Mary lie about her son? She claims she is a virgin at the time of the angelic visitation. Where does she claim she is still a virgin at the time of the conception?

Ben.

aa5874

Where does she claim that she was not a virgin at the time of conception?

According to Luke, the baby Jesus "leaped into her womb" while talking to Elisabeth who was already six months pregant.

Luke 1.41-42 I see no good reason for Mary to lie about her "son" unless of course it was all fiction.

Ben C Smith

Nowhere. Where does she claim she was a virgin at the time of conception?

I am not asking about what Luke claimed. I am asking about what Mary claimed.

Ben.

Toto

I think we have a basic problem with English here.

If you read Luke 1, the baby did not leap into her womb.

Mary visited Elizabeth who was 6 months pregnant with John the future Baptist, and the foetus inside of Elizabeth leaped inside her womb - what is usually described as the baby kicking. (This and other details convinced Randel Helms that gLuke was written by a woman.) This was supposed to indicate that John the Baptist recognized the blessedness of Mary and her forthcoming child Jesus, although it is unclear at this point if Mary is pregnant.

Ben C Smith

Good catch. I completely missed that this is how aa5874 was reading this episode. Just when I begin to think I have seen it all....

Ben.

ETA: You know, I actually get one hit on Google for the phrase the baby leaped into her womb. And about 5000 for the baby leaped in her womb.

aa5874

I am certainly not impressed with your interpretation.

It would appear to me that the word "leaped" was used with respect to the miraculous conception of the baby of Mary. The author was probably trying to describe some type of sudden phenomenal change in Mary physical appearance, i.e she suddenly physically appeared to be pregnant.

Amaleq13

Do you know of any scholar who supports your reading?

If this all took place inside Mary, how did Elizabeth know? It doesn't say she suddenly became visibly pregnant.

Shouldn't the fact that it is Elizabeth reacting to the leaping fetus be a clue that it was the one in her womb responding to the one in Mary's?

aa5874

I do not represent scholars, I represent myself. I am not obligated to accept or reject any scholar.

How did Mary know that she was talking to angel in first place?

These appear to be all miraculous events, or some kind of magic tricks. I think the Holy Ghost, based on Luke1.41-42, may have just "leaped" into Mary and made her look physically pregnant all of a sudden.

dog-on

You are serious?

18This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit. 19Because Joseph her husband was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.
20But after he had considered this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, "Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. 21She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus,[c] because he will save his people from their sins."

22All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet: 23"The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel"[d]—which means, "God with us."

24When Joseph woke up, he did what the angel of the Lord had commanded him and took Mary home as his wife. 25But he had no union with her until she gave birth to a son. And he gave him the name Jesus.