Freethought & Rationalism Archive

outhouse · 04-17-2012, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

Paul as a Roman citizen is a legend created midway through Acts to likely to add the rationale to Paul's legendary end in Rome. We know from Romans that Paul intended to come to Rome on his own to preach the gospel (Rom 1:15, 15:22), so Paul in Acts suffering gross machinations from the despicable Zionists is likely just a ploy of the Lord Jesus to get himself proclaimed in Rome (Acts 23:11).

The thing to observe is when Paul is arrested, beaten and shackled in Philippi (Acts 16), on a bonkum charge that Jewish beliefs are contrary to Roman custom, he does not peep a word about his being a citizen. It is only when he and Silas are released, Paul claims his rights.

Best,
Jiri

while acts tries to tone down paul, the end results end up being almost the same.

We know the author of GLuke copied other sources, its debated if he used the epistles.

I could see him using the Herodian script to make a great claim for his roman citizenship.

I have never trusted paul as a pharisee.

sotto voce · 04-17-2012, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

The thing to observe is when Paul is arrested, beaten and shackled in Philippi (Acts 16), on a bonkum charge that Jewish beliefs are contrary to Roman custom, he does not peep a word about his being a citizen.

That's not known. It may be that their protests were ignored, or unheard in the haste and uproar. The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

What evidence ?

The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

Toto · 04-17-2012, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

...That's not known. It may be that their protests were ignored, or unheard in the haste and uproar. The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

What evidence ?

The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

That's not "evidence." That's the plot of the story line.

And your answer is non-responsive.

aa5874 · 04-17-2012, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvduv

....A better question is of course whether the fellow written about in Acts and whose name appears on epistles even existed at all. Acts is one book as compared with the Islamic hadiths which number in the thousands, and there are still reasons to question the existence of Mohammed. So Paul all the moreso....

There are many many questions but the author of Corinthians claimed he was the Guy in the Basket by the wall in Damascus during the reign of King Aretas just as it is mentioned in Acts of the Apostles.

1 Cor 11

Quote:

32In Damascus the governor under Aretas the king kept the city of the Damascenes with a garrison , desirous to apprehend me: 33And through a window in a basket was I let down by the wall, and escaped his hands..

Acts 9

Quote:

.... the Jews took counsel to kill him:24But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him. 25Then the disciples took him by night, and let him down by the wall in a basket.

It seems as though the author of Acts and the Corinthian writer agree on the content of the basket but is it fact or fiction?? Both the author of Acts and the Corinthian writer are known fiction writers.

sotto voce · 04-17-2012, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

...That's not known. It may be that their protests were ignored, or unheard in the haste and uproar. The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

What evidence ?

The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

That's not "evidence." That's the plot of the story line.

Let's see evidence that it is invented.

Duvduv · 04-17-2012, 05:11 PM

There is no point in ignoring all the differences just because of a story where a guy went down in a basket as part of a story line that is quite different entirely in Acts and in 1 Corinthians. It's like saying well, in 1 Corinthians and in Acts the writers both talk about "Jesus" and not Tom or Jeff, so they must both mean the same thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duvduv

....A better question is of course whether the fellow written about in Acts and whose name appears on epistles even existed at all. Acts is one book as compared with the Islamic hadiths which number in the thousands, and there are still reasons to question the existence of Mohammed. So Paul all the moreso....

There are many many questions but the author of Corinthians claimed he was the Guy in the Basket by the wall in Damascus during the reign of King Aretas just as it is mentioned in Acts of the Apostles.

1 Cor 11

Acts 9

Quote:

.... the Jews took counsel to kill him:24But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him. 25Then the disciples took him by night, and let him down by the wall in a basket.

It seems as though the author of Acts and the Corinthian writer agree on the content of the basket but is it fact or fiction?? Both the author of Acts and the Corinthian writer are known fiction writers.

mountainman · 04-17-2012, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

...That's not known. It may be that their protests were ignored, or unheard in the haste and uproar. The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

What evidence ?

The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

That's not "evidence." That's the plot of the story line.

Let's see evidence that it is invented.

"The fabrication of the Christians
is a fiction of men composed by wickedness.

Though it has in it nothing divine,
by making full use of that part of the soul
which loves fable and is childish and foolish,
it has induced men to believe
that the monstrous tale is truth."

Bullburner, c.361 CE

James The Least · 04-17-2012, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

Paul as a Roman citizen is a legend created midway through Acts to likely to add the rationale to Paul's legendary end in Rome. We know from Romans that Paul intended to come to Rome on his own to preach the gospel (Rom 1:15, 15:22), so Paul in Acts suffering gross machinations from the despicable Zionists is likely just a ploy of the Lord Jesus to get himself proclaimed in Rome (Acts 23:11).

The thing to observe is when Paul is arrested, beaten and shackled in Philippi (Acts 16), on a bonkum charge that Jewish beliefs are contrary to Roman custom, he does not peep a word about his being a citizen. It is only when he and Silas are released, Paul claims his rights.

Best,
Jiri

Reading Acts, you can tell the guy is just making it up as he goes along.

sotto voce · 04-17-2012, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

...That's not known. It may be that their protests were ignored, or unheard in the haste and uproar. The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

What evidence ?

The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

That's not "evidence." That's the plot of the story line.

Let's see evidence that it is invented.

[indent][i]"The fabrication of the Christians
is a fiction of men composed by wickedness.

So why have the wicked so consistently opposed it? Why have the powerful so consistently believed it?

mountainman · 04-17-2012, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by sotto voce

...That's not known. It may be that their protests were ignored, or unheard in the haste and uproar. The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solo

What evidence ?

The evidence is that, because they released the prisoners after one night, the magistrates realised they had acted under crowd pressure, even before they knew that Paul and Silas were Roman citizens.

That's not "evidence." That's the plot of the story line.

Let's see evidence that it is invented.

[indent][i]"The fabrication of the Christians
is a fiction of men composed by wickedness.

So why have the wicked so consistently opposed it?

Julian is better described as an academic.

Quote:

Why have the powerful so consistently believed it?

$tatu$ quo

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