Koyaanisqatsi

Why should the story of Mohammed be so fascinating to so many?

Why should the story of {insert any mythological character from literary history} be so fascinating to so many?

Why was The Dukes of Hazzard so fascinating to so many?

Why has magic been so fascinating to so many? Particularly since it's always a fraud?

Shall I continue?

ETA: I mean this in the best possible light, Peter, but don't you think it might be prudent to turn to a qualified psychologist or similar therapist to deal with any emotional problems you might be having, rather than returning to a familiar fantasy world that can only comfort you through blind, irrational acceptance in spite of the evidence against it and not because of the evidence to support it?

Wouldn't that simply be an argument from denial, or self-delusion and if so, can that ultimately be beneficial? To paraphrase the Bard, "The truth will out."

:huh:

neilgodfrey

Yep, that's what I did. But I could still not escape from making political, social and religious commentary. But it was refreshing to engage with a fantasy character more transparent, clearcut, and a notch higher on the "humanity" scale than Jesus, even if only for a couple of hours.

But seriously, I find biblical studies a relaxing sanity-restoring diversion from the real heaviness of far more serious issues that confront the world. Some things are too important for so much talkfesting.

Neil Godfrey

http://vridar.wordpress.com

judge

Hey... I would love to hear your thoughts on this (assuming you aren't taking the piss)

No Robots

The attempted reformation of Judaism by Jesus can be construed as a necessarily new religion for conscious men rather than bicameral men. Behavior now must be changed from within the new consciousness rather than from Mosaic laws carving behavior from without. Sin and penance are now within conscious desire and conscious contrition, rather than in the external behaviors of the decalogue and the penances of temple sacrifice and community punishment. The divine kingdom to be regained is psychological not physical. It is metaphorical not literal. It is 'within' not in extenso.--Julian Jaynes / The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind (or via: amazon.co.uk), p. 318.

The main development of this line of thought is found in Constantin Brunner's Our Christ. Here is how Protestant theologian Kornelis Miskotte summarized Brunner's position:

Constantin Brunner declared that when Jesus said 'Father,' this was a veiled rejection of the religion of the disciples and a hidden profession of 'atheistic' salvation. Naturally this raised a storm of indignation among the religious liberals. We too believe that Brunner's assertion is untenable, but that it comes closer to the mystery of this giving of a new name to God than does the interpretation which regards the name 'Father' as the apex of general religious experience.--Kornelis Miskotte / When the Gods are Silent (or via: amazon.co.uk).

Further discussion should probably go in my Brunner thread.

neilgodfrey

Another angle on this type of perspective is found in The Existential Jesus by John Carroll. Jesus "shows the way" of the essence of human existence -- i.e. a man whole, without god and alone.

Neil Godfrey

Peter Kirby

These questions can have answers; it's unscientific to act as though we should be content with the brute facts without any kind of understanding.

Oh, and you have no clue what emotional state I am in, so... :banghead:.

Toto

You can't let go of the Jesus problem because you can't find a good solution. It's like an unsolved puzzle.

But occasionally you feel like there might not even be a solution, and it's like you're banging your head against a wall. That's when the ennui kicks in.

Solo

Reminds me of another graffiti: appended to an oversized Jesus is the Answer on a billboard was a small-hand scrawl we know that but what is the damn question ?.

Jiri

-Jay-

Have you checked out John McWhorter's "The Power of Babel: A Natural History of Language"? I've found it to be quite fascinating and very readable. Jared Diamond's "Guns, Germs, and Steel" and "Collapse" are also very good reads, although folks seem to be fairly polarized in their responses to his theses.

regards,

NinJay

judge

Ok I am superficially familiar with this book. I had a recent girlfriend who gave me another book to read which drew on this work. She was atheist. I can't remeber the name of the book though at the moment. Interestingly the book also to a somewhat lesser extent drew on the ideas of Vernon Howard.
I say this because if there was one book I would reccommend for anyone it is his The mystic path to cosmic power. I didn't recommend it here as it has nothing to do with history.
Apparently (according to this other book) Vernon Howard was atheist (?) (or perhaps christian mystic (?) ) yet I find his explanations of spiritual ideas and concepts the clearest I have seen.

Ok I'll check it out, thanks. I'm not sure if i get this last sentence full though.