figuer

True, but dark complexions are common to the Mediterranean basin, and some hellenes can be quite dark.

Derec

Sure, he could be, but what I am saying is that the mere fact of him being born in Egypt does not warrant a conclusion that he probably was. In other words, his birthplace (Alexandria) tells us nothing about his complexion.

gentleexit

I looked in them and in later fathers and his own writings. Nothing. As I said, Julian said he was short but didn't go into color (physical or spiritual!). And that was a one-off reference. It doesn't even merit the general assertion that "his enemies called him short", let alone THEY formed some chorus and jeered him as the "black dwarf".

them and even wider. Earnest, white-bread folks too. It's a respectable mantle.

And back then, the image of an Egyptian was of someone relative short and dark (Ammianus gives a graphic description of the "typical" Egyptian).

Yep. Who were they and who wrote they said it? All we appear to have are plenty of unsourced claims (just google: athanasius "black dwarf") and no ancients, that I can find.

If it is a modern "summary", that would be interesting. Who set the ball rolling? Gibbon's innocent. I checked.

Roger Pearse

I wonder... are we looking in the wrong place? Is this perhaps to do with the Athanasian Creed? The phrase sounds as if it might have been invented in the 19th century. The dwarf would be a nasty version of the ancient comment; the 'black' would be a smear on the clause in the creed that condemns anyone who does not keep it to damnation.

Just a thought.

Toto

By the way, is this you, gentleexit? http://www.conorpdowling.com/

gentleexit

Could very well be. I looked quickly just now through Dean Inge and didn't see a "black dwarf" but it was a quick look. I don't know much about the grandees of that time - though they were opinionated, rarely just gave things as they read them. Will look more.

ps: yep, Toto, that's my web site and rough now. It'll be better by Christmas.

andrewcriddle

I have a suspicion that the source of Black Dwarf as an epithet for Athanasius goes back to The Story of Christianity volume 1 (or via: amazon.co.uk) p 173 by Gonzalez .
This is a (reasonably) reputable academic work but not one I currently have access to. It would be interesting to see if Gonzalez gives a primary source.

Andrew Criddle

truth_child

ive been saved for a number of years and this is the first time i evr heard of the black dwarf

Toto

The Amazon readers shows the phrase used on p. 174 and 174, but not footnotes. I don't see any notes in that book at all.

gentleexit

P173 on books.google and no footnote. The book's from 1984. Um. How to find if anyone earlier used the epithet ...