BMC

So, we give money to the church to show god that we are devoted to him and are willing to prove it with our livelihood. I just can't make sense of it at all. If there is a god why would he need our money? Secondly, he should already know that we are devoted to him without sacrificing our cable money. Thirdly, how in the hell do people like Joyce Meyers look at themselves in the mirror of their million dollar estate without wretching. I just don't understand it. What would happen if everyone started burning their money that they wished to donate to god? Wouldn't god know that we intended to give the money to him? And if god supports the churches--then they should be fine without our tithes?

This among much of what I feel is hypocrisy--I'm just stumbling in the dark about it all really trying to find some solid ground! Please feel free to add your thoughts or frustrations here

WCH

For one thing, it isn't God who gets the money, it's the Church. For another, most priests are not Joyce Meyers. My father is an Anglican priest, and we're pretty solidly lower-middle class; he makes enough money to support the family and to spend a little, but there isn't much left over, and we've been close to not making mortgage payments once or twice. Additionally, rector's salary is only a fraction of the money given to the Church. It's also used to fund programs such as Sunday School, Vacation Bible School, outreach programs, even things like Alcoholics Anonymous which the Church supports and gives space to once a week, and, of course, basic upkeep costs like heat, water and electricity. Beyond that, a certain percentage of the money is put towards such things as helping the homeless and supporting AIDS victims in Africa.

So... if you just burned your money instead, A) families like mine would starve, B) Churches would close down, C) charities would take a hit. Doesn't sound like what God would want to me.

Skeptic Pete

Yeah this whole concept of tithing is very interesting to me.
Here in Australia I don't think that it is common, I may be wrong.

What I do remember from my childhood growing up in a Methodist church was a collection plate being passed along the pews during intermission. (obviously not called intermission but the word is appropriate)

Some people would put their donation in the plate in an envelope but most would put the cash straight into the plate.
I'm sure it was a pretty humiliating experiance for anyone who couldnt match what their neighbour had donated.

As a child I thought this money went to charity (and it possibly did considering the church back then was chocked to the rafters with congregation) but today I'm pretty sure it just pays the wages of the clergy etc.

BMC

WCH, I realize I have probably offended you and/or your family for that I apologize. Please, since I'm quite clueless as to the texts, could you provide some verses about tithing--I was under the impression from my not-so-long ago childhood that tithing was a show of faith that you do not believe in "wordly possessions." And, it was a sign that you have faith in God. I suppose being raised in a christian church that believed in constant tithing "Give all you can give" type philosophy to give them 4 basketball courts, an indoor swimming pool, and acres upon acres of land for the church seems just a touch much.

Nostalgic Pushhead

I bet its a case of WalChurch Inc vs Ma & Father churches.

I guess they gotta get $$$ to keep the place running; but without a doubt the large mega-churches extort.

But hey, a fool and his money...

IrishGuy

I hate to resort to the ol' "We can know the thoughts of God Card," but uhh...we can't know the thoughts of God. Just because it doesn't make sense to us doesn't that it doesn't make sense. I could just as easily ask "Why does God give us arms? Why doesn't He just eliminate the need to pick anything up?"

I think that one reason that we tithe is to foster a sense of Christian community. The "clergy" and the "folk" are more dependent on each other with tithing, as opposed to God made money for the Churches. Not to mention the fact that divinely created money would cause a great deal of inflation.

I agree that pastors shouldn't be rich. It really sets a bad example. But such cases are, I think, not too common. Most of the pastors that I know are aboot lower-middle to middle class. Let's not forget all the street pastors and missions and whatnot.

Bright Life

I was told by a pastor's son that the tithing mentioned in the bible really doesn't apply to churches today. It seems Isrealites were supposed to give ten percent to the Levite tribe, so they could dedicate their time to priestly duties. This included handling the governmental aspects of the tribes (laws, edicts, that sort of thing). This is comparable to the taxes we pay the government today. According to the preacher's son, the whole 10% thing is WAY OFF, and basically just extortion.

His dad wasn't supported by the church. He was a CARPENTER ( ) during the week.

BL

TheFisherman

I can't add much more to the comments already expressed, but as an anecdotal point:

I watched my wife's grandmother "fund" the church weekly for over 20 years. When she need help (she's pushing 100!) getting to the services (and give more $), noone could find a way to do it. So, in the end, why did she give at all? She didn't get any benefit from it - "bleed'em and dump'em."

capsaicin67

WCH:Not necessarily. Your family would probably support itself doing something different for which there was a market...? I'm not saying that charity isn't a good thing, just saying.

It just struck me how socialistic the message is in many churches. And commie-hating conservatives love churches. Weird.

My father's church bulletin always has a "message" [aka sales pitch] about why the flock *really* don't need *their* own money, and how giving is godly and will enrich them spiritually etc. But the Church sure does want that money badly.

And they never have enough of it. They even sometimes have a whole separate bulletin all about shaking down the faithful for money. In fact, the whole "message" is about prying the money out of the hands of the membership---not about how to cope with life or think through tough, real-life, dilemmas. My father and his sister both commented on thefact that the Churches they attend are unlikely to provide any real-life support if they were in need. Seems a wee bit inconsistent.

The Church needs gobs of money but the people need minimal money. The best you can make out of it is that the Church is somehow better qualified to re-distribute the wealth of others than they are themeselves. Or something. But from my observation the Church is pretty fabulously wealthy compared to it's flock individually. Interesting. The Church: the cause of and solution to many problems.

Purple Smartie

I'm just curious:

1) Would donating 10% of your income to the charitable organization of your choice be acceptable to the church if you just left a note in the collection plate?
2) Are gifts to the church tax deductible in the same way gifts to Foster Parents Plan or the local soup kitchen would be?
3) Who normally decides how churches spend the money collected?

Thanks.