Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Species8472 · 04-11-2009, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Skeptic

Or perhaps you know that you are not adequately prepared to discuss those issues and do not want to embarrass yourself. It is customary and expected when making claims to provide support for the claims. People who refuse to provide support for their claims obviously know that they are not prepared to defend their claims, which means that they should not have made the claims in the first place.

Funny that...

When Christians debate theology amongst themselves, it is always very important to back up their claims in scriptures, however when they debate science, claims are rarely backed up at all, and somehow many don't even see the need to do so. They just call it defence of their faith, as if that somehow should justify intellectual dishonesty.

Doug Shaver · 04-11-2009, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sugarhitman

In pre flood times there were no nation states....Egypt did not exist.

And we should believe that just because you say it is so?

Free Indeed · 04-11-2009, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Skeptic

Message to Free Indeed: If most of your evidence is quoting the Bible, you will probably get a moderator's warning for proselytizing. Quoting the Bible within reason is fine, but it is not fine when it becomes proselytizing. Simply saying that the Bible says this or that is not evidence, especially in a forum like this. In addition, most or all skeptics at this forum are already well acquainted with the Bible.

Romans 10:17 says "So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God." Some Christians who have visited these forms and are aware of that verse have posted large amounts of Scriptures in the hopes that reading the Scriptures will help convince some skeptics to become Christians. However, that is proselytizing, and proselytizing is not allowed at these forums. How would you like it if you went to a Muslim website and Muslims tended to post large amounts of the Koran?

I have read a number of your posts at three forums. It is obvious that you are poorly prepared to debate at these forums. Merely making assertions, including quoting the Bible, will not get you anywhere at these forums. You do not even have a basic knowledge of some of the issues that you discuss. For instance, at the Evolution/Creation Forum, as evidence for the global flood, you mentioned that ammonites are found on the tops of mountains. The simple truth is that it would be very surprising if shells WERE NOT found on the tops of mountains. Leonardo da Vinci and others noted centuries ago that shells are on mountaintops because the mountains started out at sea level, and when they rose, some shells rose with them.

You conveniently refused to reply to a number of posts at the General Religious Discussions Forum, and at the Evolution/Creation Forum, and now you have refused to reply to some posts at this forum. If you continue to use that approach, soon, few if any people will take you seriously, and they will not reply to your posts.

I hate to hear that.

Johnny Skeptic · 04-11-2009, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Indeed

This should help explain why there is no written record of a global flood in Egypt. It’s because Egypt wasn’t inhabited until after the flood and tower of Babel.

Nope, a global flood did not occur, as even a number of Christian experts have stated. In addition, the earth is old, as even a number of Christian experts have stated. Your main problem is that you are an inerrantist. Inerrantists simply rubber stamp everything that the Bible says and on occasion pretend that they are interested in discussing science when science does not actually have anything to do with inerrancy. As you know, I recently started a thread on inerrancy at http://www.freeratio.org//newreply.p...=1&p=5886806at the General Religious Discussions Forum. The title is "Inerrancy." Please reply to a reply that I just made to you in that thread.

As you also know, I recently started a thread on the flood at http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?t=265598 at the Evolution/Creation Forum. The title is "Another fundie proponent of the flood." In the opening post, I quoted some of what you said in a post at the General Religious Discussions Forum. You made some posts in that thread, then realized that you did not know what you were talking about, and conveniently vacated the thread.

As you probably also know, I recently started a new thread on the age of the earth at http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?t=265760 at the Evolution/Creation Forum. The title is "The age of the earth." I quoted some more false statements that you made at the General Religious Discussions Forum.

Minimalist · 04-11-2009, 12:02 PM

Quote:

The Bible is evidence.

The bible is a crock of shit. See how easy that is. Now where do you go when your "evidence" is rejected?

aa5874 · 04-11-2009, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minimalist

Quote:

The Bible is evidence.

The bible is a crock of shit. See how easy that is. Now where do you go when your "evidence" is rejected?

Of course the Bible is evidence.

The Bible is evidence that people believed in myths.

And, of course the Bible has history.

It has the history of people who believed in myths like Noah's global flood and the Tower of Babel.

Species8472 · 04-12-2009, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minimalist

The bible is a crock of shit. See how easy that is. Now where do you go when your "evidence" is rejected?

Of course the Bible is evidence.

The Bible is evidence that people believed in myths.

And, of course the Bible has history.

It has the history of people who believed in myths like Noah's global flood and the Tower of Babel.

Of course the bible has historical value, but one needs to separate the myths from the history. Most of it IS myth. The events that happened at the time the OT was written, around the time of the exile, has a fair bit of history in it. But the people at that time who wrote down the myths, had no means of validating the historicity of these myths, neither did they have any need to do so as the myths themselves was ideal to server their purpose.

Toto · 04-13-2009, 04:09 PM

Sugarhitman digression on prophecy

Casper · 05-08-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by show_no_mercy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Indeed

My information is 300 to 360 laminae formed in 160 years in Lake Walensee, Switzerland. We can't always assume that the rate of deposition that we see today has been the same for the past.

The rate of deposition would only matter if there were no seasons. The earth has always had a tilt of 23.5 degrees so there were always seasons. If there were no seasons then there would be no cyclical differences in deposits throughout the year.

Unless you add to your magic box of "the flood" that the earth only gained its tilt after the flood.

Actually, there would still be "seasons" corresponding to the ellipsis of the orbit and precession (wobbling on the axis). Not to mention chaotic runaway over decades.

But of course those things are a result of the hand of god tilting the earth without first turning off time (stupid OSHA regs). He was in a hurry I'm sure, and figured it was good enough for government work.

It was just a little slipup that all those people who couldn't communicate remembered how to measure, plan, orient and build things, but the ocean-going shipbuilders of the plains had forgotten exactly how to make a large craft out of wood that housed termites...

Casper · 05-08-2009, 05:08 PM

For a reversal of interpretation with the same mechanics, I recommend Robert Schock's Voyages of the Pyramid Builders: The True Origins of the Pyramids from Lost Egypt to Ancient America (or via: amazon.co.uk)

Special thanks to Apostate Abe for the original link.

It would also provide some insight on how those illiterate arid plains dwellers never quite forgot how to build ocean going vessels. Of course, it took a couple of tries before they figured out that it was easier to build them on the coast than to build them and haul them hundreds of miles to the coast. But it paid off, they developed the technology to move big rocks across the desert without wheels...

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04-13-2009, 04:09 PM	#178
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Sugarhitman digression on prophecy

05-08-2009, 05:08 PM	#180
Casper Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 430	For a reversal of interpretation with the same mechanics, I recommend Robert Schock's Voyages of the Pyramid Builders: The True Origins of the Pyramids from Lost Egypt to Ancient America (or via: amazon.co.uk) Special thanks to Apostate Abe for the original link. It would also provide some insight on how those illiterate arid plains dwellers never quite forgot how to build ocean going vessels. Of course, it took a couple of tries before they figured out that it was easier to build them on the coast than to build them and haul them hundreds of miles to the coast. But it paid off, they developed the technology to move big rocks across the desert without wheels...

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