Evoken

Nope. You got that wrong, show me where there is a contradiction, not just that it is not in The Bible.

Sven

On the other hand, protestants can make up absolutely any "science" they want, even if it conflicts with reality.
I've to say protestants win hands down.

Magus55

First of all, i'm not protestant, and I don't think Christians "make up" science. They just don't agree that everything scientists claim is fact actually is, nor do they think if its scientifically impossible, it never happened.

Magus55

Got what wrong? Catholicism says Mary was born and remained sinless. The Bible says Jesus was Mary's Savior - sinless people don't need Saviors.

Mageth

Where does it say that Jesus was Mary's saviour?

Before you answer that, note that the Bible also says "For all have sinned, and come short of the Glory of God". And yet no doubt you'd claim that Jesus never sinned.

John A. Broussard

We seem to have wandered. I guess I'll have to settle for the fact that there is no prior supporting evidence for the 5th Century claim that Mary ascended bodily into heaven.

Magus55

Luk 1:46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
Luk 1:47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.

And you're right, I would claim that Jesus never sinned. It says all come short of the glory of God. Jesus is God, and can't come short of His own glory. Its pretty obvious that verse is referring to non God-incarnate humans.

funinspace

"never sinned" as in didn't break the Laws of the Prophets? Or?

Mageth

Again, where does it say that Jesus was Mary's savior? Mary was a good little Jewish girl at the time she uttered that alleged song, remember.

And a Catholic could just say "Sure, God is Mary's Saviour. He "saved" her by freeing her from the curse of original sin through the immaculate conception."

I don't see how that's so obvious when it plainly says "For ALL have sinned, and ALL have come short of the Glory of God."

The point to my mentioning that scripture is that there are cases where one has to make exceptions for Jesus, as you do for that verse. Indeed, I understand that that verse is not intended to include Jesus. And Catholics could simply argue that there are exceptions to be made for Mary as well. IOW, they would say that verses like the above do not refer to God-incarnate humans OR their immaculately conceived virgin mothers.

Once you start making exceptions, you've opened the barn door (or stable door, in this case).

Chris Weimer

Magus55 - but then youhave to support your theory that Jesus is God, for the Father is greater than he, and he can do nothing without the Father.