Originally Posted by Iskander

I wanted to know what deniers think, that’s all.

Originally Posted by MrMacSon

Truth matters.

Especially truth of the basis for one of the major influences, if not the major influence, on western and European societies over the last 2,000 years.

Especially as there does not seem to have been proper investigation of that basis.

Originally Posted by aa5874

This shows how illogical some can be.

It is HJer who DENY the NT is accurate historically.

HJers deny that Jesus was FATHERED by a Holy Ghost, was God the Creator, that walked on water, transfigued, resurrected and ascended on a cloud to heaven.

The VERY DENIERS are accusing others WRONGLY for PRECISELY what they have done.

Some HJers have DISCREDITED their own Christian brother and sisters of antiquity as EMBELLISHERS and that they mis-represented the truth about their OWN Jesus.

This is a major disappointment for me. The very people who was expected to be fair are NOW making Blatant erroreous claims.

I do NOT and have NOT denied that Jesus was described as the Son of a Holy Ghost in gMattthew and gLuke and God the Creator in gJohn.

I cannot DENY that Jesus of the NT was described as a Myth and that there is a QUEST for an historical Jesus.

HJers DENY that the NT is historically accurate when it is stated Jesus was Fathered by a Ghost and was God the Creator.

We know the real DENIERS.

Originally Posted by sotto voce

One change is dumbing down. For whatever reason (and it may be simply economic), many Western children are today given little or no grounding in history, or even geography. They do not know where they are, in either place, or time; nor do they have any sense of historical progression. They think that milk comes from cartons, that mobile 'phones have always existed. If they were in future to be told that Jesus was a mythical character, like Apollo or Bacchus, they would not be in any position to investigate the truth of that. So people who oppose the values of Jesus see an opportunity to overcome his following. Of course, they have to silence those who resist their version of the past if the ingénue culture is to be convinced.

Another recent change is the loosening grip of denominations on believers in Jesus as Christ. The Roman Empire, based on corruption, devised a counterfeit church, under its thumb, that firmly limited the values of Jesus so that corrupt practices were not questioned, not brought to light. Protestant denominations, that grew alongside democracy, permitted the values of Jesus to be more widely applied; though still under the eyes of undemocratically appointed 'clergy', a word and concept not found in the New Testament. Today, it is quite possible that more Christians worldwide are members of democratic groups than exist as members of denominations. Though one does not notice from these groups any obvious challenge to society's values, still, there are some who are evidently twitchy about the idea of Christians not under the control of people whom they approve. It may be less of a financial motive, more of a gender issue that concerns them, but their desire to control is not too hard to discern.

Originally Posted by Toto

There is not plenty of evidence. Just try to find it.

The work for mythicists is debunking the historicist attempts to explain away this lack of evidence.

Originally Posted by Iskander

The question is very simple: was there a Jewish man with religious thoughts and followers who lived 2000 years ago in a society alien to us and destroyed by the wars (2) with the Romans?

Originally Posted by aa5874

Well, first PRODUCE the source for YOUR Jewish man.

I can investigate whether or not there was an Angel Gabriel, Satan the Devil, Pilate the Governor, Tiberius the Emperor, Caiaphas the High Priest and Jesus the Son of a Ghost and God the Creator as stated in the NT but I cannot investigate an UNKNOWN Jewish man that is NOT mentioned in any credible source of antiquity.

I cannot just look for a Jewish man from 2000 years.

What was his name??

Who were his parents??

What was his occupation??

Where did he live??

Who wrote about him??

Do you have any idea of the SIZE of the Population 2000 years ago???

Please get you act together. Who is this Jewish Man you talk about???

Are you DENYING your Jewish man is the same Son of a Ghost in the Canon??

Originally Posted by Iskander

You can’t answer my question


You are asking now what religion he preached and what attributes his followers ascribed to him, but this is theology and gossip.

Originally Posted by outhouse

There is plenty of evidence, its just question more then anyone else due to its importance.


Many historical characters have less information and evidence then jesus has, yet they carry complete historicity.

The fact the authors all wrote mythicaly gives mythers food to feed upon.