Evoken

Something is necessary if it is "Needed to achieve a certain result or effect"

What is this result or effect that God achieves as a necessary being? Can you objectively prove what God as a necessary being does which makes him necessary at all?


Valz

Agnostic Theist

Actually something is necessary if, for any possible world, if x is necessary then x exists in that world.

You're thinking of causal necessity, I'm thinking of modal necessity.

Existence of all things

Yes, my agnostic label is purely ironic :Cheeky:

Evoken

Then before God created everything, he was not necessary. Then, is he not contingent as well?


Valz

Mickey

Originally posted by Gawen

"I can agree with that. But can we heap attributes upon something that is beyond our understanding? Can we designate causes and effects from something we can know nothing about? Can we do all the above for something that has no known evidence or proof of its existence?"

What you describe is what people have always done,and seem predisposed,to do,particularly in respect of monotheism.For people who are essentially cerebral it is difficult to realise the lack of curiosity and total inability to analyse which seem to constrict many people's minds;and which is of course encouraged by early indoctrination.

Mickey

Boro Nut

The speed with which you recovered from your momentary slip was impressive to say the least Murmur. If you hadn't also momentarily forgotten to use the edit function I'm sure no one would ever have noticed.

Boro Nut

PS - Mr Crusoe was not a bishop

DMC

How does the Catholic Church gain more credibility by saying "God does not exist" than by saying "God does exist"? I give each statement equal credit, based on the evidence presented.