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stephan huller · 10-14-2011, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Jonah left a worthy son and successor in Mani II. (Mani is an abbreviation of Menachem), who was a pupil of Jose II. He lived and taught for the most part in Sepphoris. http://books.google.com/books?id=xhQ...nachem&f=false

ii

stephan huller · 10-14-2011, 10:56 AM

Is there another possible reference in Irenaeus? In AH 3.11.7 Irenaeus is IMO arguing that the Paraclete should be interpreted as just the Holy Spirit not an incarnate individual who comes after Jesus as the Marcionites and others:

Quote:

For Marcion, rejecting the entire Gospel, yea rather, cutting himself off from the Gospel, boasts that he has part in the [of] the Gospel. Others, again, that they may set at nought the gift of the Spirit, which in the latter times has been, by the good pleasure of the Father, poured out upon the human race, do not admit that aspect [of the evangelical dispensation] presented by John's Gospel, in which the Lord promised that He would send the Paraclete; John 14:16, etc. but set aside at once both the Gospel and the prophetic Spirit. Wretched men indeed! Who wish to be pseudo-prophets, forsooth, but who set aside the gift of prophecy from the Church; acting like those who, on account of such as come in hypocrisy, hold themselves aloof from the communion of the brethren. We must conclude, moreover, that these men can not admit the Apostle Paul either. For, in his Epistle to the Corinthians, 1 Corinthians 11:4-5 he speaks expressly of prophetical gifts, and recognises men and women prophesying in the Church. Sinning, therefore, in all these particulars, against the Spirit of God, Matthew 12:31 they fall into the irremissible sin. [Irenaeus AH 3.11.7]

There is something here about an interpretation of the Paraclete figure which contradicts the Catholic assumptions about it being 'just' a Holy Spirit which came down on Pentecost as in Acts. I think these are Marcionites not Montanists and Encratites (as the translators have traditionally suggested). This group clearly used a longer version of Mark (see what appears before in Irenaeus).

Toto · 10-14-2011, 11:26 AM

The discussion of Mani has been split off here

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10-14-2011, 11:26 AM	#23
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	The discussion of Mani has been split off here

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