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Old 03-21-2010, 01:39 AM   #11
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Mk 1: 7- 8 John's Preaching re Jesus Mt 3:11-12 Lk 3:15-18
1:7And he preached, saying, There cometh after me he that is mightier than I, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to stoop down and unloose.
1:8I baptized you in water; But he shall baptize you in the Holy Spirit.

Mt 3:11-12 John's Preaching re Jesus Mk 1: 7- 8 Lk 3:15-18
11. I indeed baptize you in water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you in the Holy Spirit and [in] fire:
12. whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly cleanse his threshing-floor; and he will gather his wheat into the garner, but the chaff he will burn up with unquenchable fire.


Lk 3:15-18 John's Preaching re Jesus Mk 1: 7- 8 Mt 3:11-12
3:15 And as the people were in expectation, and all men reasoned in their hearts concerning John, whether haply he were the Christ; 3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but there cometh he that is mightier than I, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you in the Holy Spirit and in fire: 3:17 whose fan is in his hand, thoroughly to cleanse his threshing-floor, and to gather the wheat into his garner; but the chaff he will burn up with unquenchable fire. 3:18 With many other exhortations therefore preached he good tidings unto the people;
ASV American Standard Version

In red, what is not found in gMk
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Old 03-21-2010, 03:12 AM   #12
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Here is Luke's Special Material for the parables.

Good Samaritan (Lk 10:29-37)
Persistent Knocking (Lk 11:5-8)
Wealthy farmer (Lk 12:16-20)
Unfruitful fig tree (Lk 13:6-9)
Places at table (Lk 14:7-11)
Tower builder (Lk 14:28-30)
King contemplating war (Lk 14:31-32)
Lost Coin Parable (Lk 15:7-10)
Prodigal Son Parable (Lk 15:11-32)
Unjust Manager Parable (Lk 16:1-12)
Rich man and Lazarus (Lk 16:19-31)
Dutiful servant (Lk 17:7-10)
Ten Leper Healing (Lk 17:11-19)
The Kingdom of God is Within You (Lk 17:20-21)
Persistent widow & Unjust Judge Parable (Lk 18:1-8)
Pharisee and Tax collector Parable (Lk 18:9-14)
Zacchaeus (Lk 19: 1-10)
Jerusalem Destruction Prediction (Lk 19:39-44)
Before Herod (Lk 23: 6-16)
Daughters of Jerusalem (Lk 23:27-32)
Father Forgive Them (Lk 23:34)

All these stories could belong to Q, if we accept the definition :
gMark was a source for gMatthew and gLuke, both of whom also independently used a now lost sayings source called Q.

But how (why ?) all these parables were not included in gMatthew as we know it today ?

Probably we do not have Version 2 or 3 of the gospels, but V17.4...
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Old 03-21-2010, 09:33 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huon View Post
Here is Luke's Special Material for the parables.

Good Samaritan (Lk 10:29-37)
Persistent Knocking (Lk 11:5-8)
Wealthy farmer (Lk 12:16-20)
Unfruitful fig tree (Lk 13:6-9)
Places at table (Lk 14:7-11)
Tower builder (Lk 14:28-30)
King contemplating war (Lk 14:31-32)
Lost Coin Parable (Lk 15:7-10)
Prodigal Son Parable (Lk 15:11-32)
Unjust Manager Parable (Lk 16:1-12)
Rich man and Lazarus (Lk 16:19-31)
Dutiful servant (Lk 17:7-10)
Ten Leper Healing (Lk 17:11-19)
The Kingdom of God is Within You (Lk 17:20-21)
Persistent widow & Unjust Judge Parable (Lk 18:1-8)
Pharisee and Tax collector Parable (Lk 18:9-14)
Zacchaeus (Lk 19: 1-10)
Jerusalem Destruction Prediction (Lk 19:39-44)
Before Herod (Lk 23: 6-16)
Daughters of Jerusalem (Lk 23:27-32)
Father Forgive Them (Lk 23:34)

All these stories could belong to Q, if we accept the definition :
gMark was a source for gMatthew and gLuke, both of whom also independently used a now lost sayings source called Q.

But how (why ?) all these parables were not included in gMatthew as we know it today ?

Probably we do not have Version 2 or 3 of the gospels, but V17.4...
It is of interest to note that not one single parable can be found in the Pauline writings. Not one single piece of "Q" material is in any Pauline writing, not even a verse.

This is a most compelling indication that the Synoptics are not at all related to the Pauline writings.

And, we know that the later gospel called gJohn does not contain any parables or "Q" material at all like those in the Synoptics.
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Old 03-21-2010, 10:45 AM   #14
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Here is gMark's Special Material.
Mk 3:20-21 Accusations Against Jesus

3:20 And the multitude cometh together again, so that they could not so much as eat bread.
3:21 And when his friends heard it, they went out to lay hold on him: for they said, He is beside himself.

Mk 4:26-29 Secret Seed Parable
Mk 7:31-37 Inarticulate Deaf Person
Mk 8:22-26 Blind Man of Bethsaida

Clearly, these 3 parables do not belong to Q ...
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Old 03-21-2010, 03:56 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aa
It is of interest to note that not one single parable can be found in the Pauline writings. Not one single piece of "Q" material is in any Pauline writing, not even a verse.

This is a most compelling indication that the Synoptics are not at all related to the Pauline writings.
Thank-you.

Sometimes the obvious needs to be restated.

Earl Doherty
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Old 03-22-2010, 09:08 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlDoherty View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by aa
It is of interest to note that not one single parable can be found in the Pauline writings. Not one single piece of "Q" material is in any Pauline writing, not even a verse.

This is a most compelling indication that the Synoptics are not at all related to the Pauline writings.
Thank-you.

Sometimes the obvious needs to be restated.

Earl Doherty
Robert G. Price views the gospel of Mark as allegorical fiction about a failed Pauline tradition, perhaps written by a follower of Paul, or a member of that tradition. http://www.rationalrevolution.net/ar...h_followup.htm
So, in that sense there may be a relationship with the synoptics and Pauline writings, but not with Q.
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