Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Chili · 01-10-2013, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

Time will tell.

Two thousand years is enough. You seem to enjoy being a Victim of the Church of Rome.

Once you read and analyze the "Donation of Constantine", "Church History" and "Against Heresies" then it becomes rather easy to deduce that the Church of Rome most likely did NOT compose Justin' works..

Victim? Do I sense some agony here because their entropy is running out soon and our days are not so bright as they once were?

They never were in the business of arguing with people who do not understand but just be the leading edge of civilization that came to a dead stop when the reform movement took control . . . and so the switch has been thrown and we went downhill ever since.

Chili · 01-10-2013, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

As mountainman would ask manuscrips DATED by whom? A bunch of professional Christian theologians? That is your 'evidence'? impressive.

Why not just let the friggin Pope date 'em for you and be done with it.

, Would save some money too, and likely be more true.

Sheshbazzar · 01-10-2013, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

Time will tell.

Two thousand years is enough.

Nope. But there is a number. Haven't you heard? No Italian opera is ever over until the fat lady sings.

We're here for the show, and this particular show isn't over yet, not by a long sight.

Not as long as that fat old Whore is still perched over many waters.

She has a few more scenes, but her hour approaches,

Then it will finally be curtains for her.

FINIS -The End-

aa5874 · 01-11-2013, 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

Time will tell.

Two thousand years is enough.

Nope. But there is a number. Haven't you heard? No Italian opera is ever over until the fat lady sings.

We're here for the show, and this particular show isn't over yet, not by a long sight.

Not as long as that fat old Whore is still perched over many waters.

She has a few more scenes, but her hour approaches,

Then it will finally be curtains for her.

FINIS -The End-

You live in a dream world.

The "SHOW" is over.

This is the END.

We know who Forged writings.

We know it was the Church of Rome.

Chili · 01-11-2013, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

[ And the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her whoredoms.

You missed the punchline and the song will go on, forever and ever wherein the blood of God's holy ones is the blood of those martyred for their faith in Jesus.

"And damned be him who cries 'hold enough,'" my Jesus will be there when I die.

And you do not see the satire in this?

Even animals know to lick up their own placenta and not worship it instead, to say that Jesus was the cocoon stage and the old worm is like dust left behind.

mountainman · 01-11-2013, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

As mountainman would ask manuscrips DATED by whom? A bunch of professional Christian theologians? That is your 'evidence'? impressive.

Why not just let the friggin Pope date 'em for you and be done with it.

Paleography is Not related to Christian theology or Theologians.

Are you sure about that?

WIKI:

Quote:

A New Testament papyrus is a copy of a portion of the New Testament made on papyrus. To date, over one hundred and twenty such papyri are known. In general, they are considered the earliest witnesses to the original text of the New Testament.[1]

This elite status among New Testament manuscripts only began in the 20th century.

The grouping was first introduced by Caspar René Gregory, who assigned papyri texts the Blackletter character \mathfrak{P} followed by a superscript number. Before 1900, only 9 papyri manuscripts were known, and only one had been cited in a critical apparatus (\mathfrak{P}11 by Constantin von Tischendorf). These 9 papyri were just single fragments, except for \mathfrak{P}15, which consisted of a single whole leaf.[2] The discoveries of the twentieth century brought about the earliest known New Testament manuscript fragments.[3] Kenyon in 1912 knew 14 papyri,[4] Aland in his first edition of Kurzgefasste... in 1963 enumerated 76 papyri.

Caspar René Gregory

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Caspar René Gregory (November 6, 1846–April 9, 1917) was an American-born German theologian.

Lobegott Friedrich Constantin (von) Tischendorf

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Lobegott Friedrich Constantin (von) Tischendorf (January 18, 1815 – December 7, 1874) was a noted German Biblical scholar.

Kenyon

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Sir Frederic George Kenyon GBE KCB TD FBA FSA (15 January 1863 – 23 August 1952) was a British paleographer and biblical and classical scholar.

Aland

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Kurt Aland (28 March 1915 – 13 April 1994) was a German Theologian and Biblical Scholar who specialized in New Testament textual criticism.

Sheshbazzar · 01-11-2013, 09:23 AM

Nice totally unbiased group that would be hey.

aa5874 · 01-11-2013, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

Quote:

Originally Posted by aa5874

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

As mountainman would ask manuscrips DATED by whom? A bunch of professional Christian theologians? That is your 'evidence'? impressive.

Why not just let the friggin Pope date 'em for you and be done with it.

Paleography is Not related to Christian theology or Theologians.

Are you sure about that?

WIKI:

Quote:

A New Testament papyrus is a copy of a portion of the New Testament made on papyrus. To date, over one hundred and twenty such papyri are known. In general, they are considered the earliest witnesses to the original text of the New Testament.[1]

This elite status among New Testament manuscripts only began in the 20th century.

The grouping was first introduced by Caspar René Gregory, who assigned papyri texts the Blackletter character \mathfrak{P} followed by a superscript number. Before 1900, only 9 papyri manuscripts were known, and only one had been cited in a critical apparatus (\mathfrak{P}11 by Constantin von Tischendorf). These 9 papyri were just single fragments, except for \mathfrak{P}15, which consisted of a single whole leaf.[2] The discoveries of the twentieth century brought about the earliest known New Testament manuscript fragments.[3] Kenyon in 1912 knew 14 papyri,[4] Aland in his first edition of Kurzgefasste... in 1963 enumerated 76 papyri.

Caspar René Gregory

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Caspar René Gregory (November 6, 1846–April 9, 1917) was an American-born German theologian.

Lobegott Friedrich Constantin (von) Tischendorf

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Lobegott Friedrich Constantin (von) Tischendorf (January 18, 1815 – December 7, 1874) was a noted German Biblical scholar.

Kenyon

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Sir Frederic George Kenyon GBE KCB TD FBA FSA (15 January 1863 – 23 August 1952) was a British paleographer and biblical and classical scholar.

Aland

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIKI

Kurt Aland (28 March 1915 – 13 April 1994) was a German Theologian and Biblical Scholar who specialized in New Testament textual criticism.

I am completely shocked that you would give the impression that Paleography is directly related to Christian Theologians.

It is like claiming Galileo was a Catholic therefore his work in Astronomy is bias and of no Scientific value.

There are Christians Theologians who may Paleographers just like there may be Christian Theologians who are engage in the Field of Science.

You very well know that Paleography is the study of ALL ANCIENT WRITING--NOT just Christian writing.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palaeography

Quote:

Palaeography or Palæography, also spelt paleography (from Greek παλαιός palaiós, "old" and γράφειν graphein, "to write") is the study of ancient writing. Included in the discipline is the practice of deciphering, reading, and dating historical manuscripts,[2] and the cultural context of writing, including the methods with which writing and books were produced, and the history of scriptoria.[3]...

Sheshbazzar · 01-11-2013, 05:34 PM

So are we to understand aa, that your position is that these trained Christian Theologians harbor no biases?

That the findings and decisions of trained Christian Theologians are to be accounted as totally free from any bias,
and therefore their 'authoritative' decisions and claims about the genuineness or the age of any text should never be doubted or disputed?

aa5874 · 01-11-2013, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

So are we to understand aa, that your position is that these trained Christian Theologians harbor no biases?

That the findings and decisions of trained Christian Theologians are to be accounted as totally free from any bias,
and therefore their 'authoritative' decisions and claims about the genuineness or the age of any text should never be doubted or disputed?

Again, it was completely mis-leading for mountainman to give the impression that Palaeography is directly related to Christian Theologians.

Please, first do some research on Palaeography because it is evident you do not understand what Palaeographers do and the limits of C 14.

Again, C 14 DATES a blank piece of the MATERIAL used--NOT the Text itself.

C 14 DATING cannot detect some kind of forgeries where LATE Text is added to very early material giving the false appearance of being early.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

01-11-2013, 09:23 AM	#47
Sheshbazzar Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: On the path of knowledge Posts: 8,889	Nice totally unbiased group that would be hey.

01-11-2013, 05:34 PM	#49
Sheshbazzar Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: On the path of knowledge Posts: 8,889	So are we to understand aa, that your position is that these trained Christian Theologians harbor no biases? That the findings and decisions of trained Christian Theologians are to be accounted as totally free from any bias, and therefore their 'authoritative' decisions and claims about the genuineness or the age of any text should never be doubted or disputed?

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.