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Old 09-03-2009, 01:02 PM   #431
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Are you suggesting that "Brother of the Lord" is a proper name like "Ahijah?"
No, Paul assigns divinity to Jesus, it is apparent from Paul's use of kurios that Yahweh = The Lord = Jesus.

As un-palatable as you may find it.
I see what you are saying. "Kurios/Lord" means God, i.e. Yahweh. So we are entirely justified as reading Gal. 1:19 as "James the brother of Yahweh."
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:05 PM   #432
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No, Paul assigns divinity to Jesus, it is apparent from Paul's use of kurios that Yahweh = The Lord = Jesus.

As un-palatable as you may find it.
I see what you are saying. "Kurios/Lord" means God, i.e. Yahweh. So we are entirely justified as reading Gal. 1:19 as "James the brother of Yahweh."
He is referring to James as the brother of Jesus, who happens to be Yahweh incarnated.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:07 PM   #433
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No, Paul assigns divinity to Jesus, it is apparent from Paul's use of kurios that Yahweh = The Lord = Jesus.

As un-palatable as you may find it.
There is considerable discussion of the application of kurios to Christ in the NT. Paul may be guilty of some theomorphising, but he is guilty of theomorphising the man Christ:
With regard to Paul himself, we cannot know whether and how far the pure well-spring of mysticism was polluted by the murky stream of superstition. Because the Paul who has come down to us in the epistles is no more the real Paul than the Christ of the gospels is the real Christ. What made the real Christ the greatest of the prophets was the fact that he proclaimed himself, his human Self, and thus proclaimed Man. However far Paul may or may not have been able to follow him, and whether or not he engages in theomorphism, he did in any case theomorphose the man Christ—who is descended from David—for God is surely not descended from David!--Constantin Brunner
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:10 PM   #434
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I would not argue that. It is the relevance that is in question.
Are you suggesting that "Brother of the Lord" is a proper name like "Ahijah?"
If the name given to you was say "Yahweh is my judge", nice and overt like that, in a Yahwistic society, would you think that it was just a name? The idea must be seen to be significant. That it is a name is only natural when the names are most commonly theophoric in natural, but the idea must be acceptable in its import. The idea that Yahweh is one's father is a natural idea, Jews considered themseves sons of god, and we have the name Abijah - "my father is Yahweh". We have to consider the content of the name Ahijah as significant to Jews. Why call someone "my brother is Yahweh" if it doesn't have significance, yet its meaning is transparent because it is your language? You can ignore the fact that Daniel means "god is my judge", because it's not in your face, it's a foreign language. Who thinks of the significance of Stephen <- stefanos (= crown)? It's not your language and the significance of names are so disguised these days. Christine = of christ!? Francesco = little Frenchman. Dennis = Dionysus = the god of Nysos. In ancient times names meant something and it was transparently obvious to everyone in the culture.

So the idea "my brother is Yahweh" has cultural significance: it ended up a name. The notion of being a brother of the lord is part of Paul's cultural heritage, being originally a conservative Jew who'd studied his religion. It has the added benefit of the connotations of "brother" in Pauline thought, as a brother believer of the lord.


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Old 09-03-2009, 01:12 PM   #435
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Yes, most proper Jewish names have some cultural significance. This brother of the Lord, for example, is named after the patriarch, Jacob.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:13 PM   #436
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I see what you are saying. "Kurios/Lord" means God, i.e. Yahweh. So we are entirely justified as reading Gal. 1:19 as "James the brother of Yahweh."
He is referring to James as the brother of Jesus, who happens to be Yahweh incarnated.
Superstitious nonsense. The text says, brother of the Lord, not brother of Jesus. You are inserting dogmatics into a historical discussion.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:23 PM   #437
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Yes, most proper Jewish names have some cultural significance. This brother of the Lord, for example, is named after the patriarch, Jacob.
This James is labeled with the Hebrew idea "the brother of the lord".


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Old 09-03-2009, 02:03 PM   #438
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It is clear that by "the Lord" Paul means Christ, and by "brother" he means the fleshly brother of Christ. Anything else is just mythologism run amuck.
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Old 09-03-2009, 02:24 PM   #439
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He is referring to James as the brother of Jesus, who happens to be Yahweh incarnated.
You are imposing your own beliefs onto Paul with that last phrase. He does not describe himself as holding a belief that Jesus was Yahweh incarnate.
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Old 09-03-2009, 02:30 PM   #440
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It is clear that by "the Lord" Paul means Christ, and by "brother" he means the fleshly brother of Christ.
It isn't clear to me that Paul would consider such a concept (a fleshy brother of Christ) to make sense. In fact, given what he has to say elsewhere about "fleshy" things and his expressed desire to be considered equal to the other apostles, this is a problematic reference even if one assumes an HJ.
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