Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Toto · 10-11-2012, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by No Robots

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Shmuley Boteach? reasonable?

Never a dull moment here, but this thread has gone from the ridiculous to the hilarious.

Boteach stands an excellent chance of election next month. ...

Boteach got half a million bucks from Sheldon Adelson

I'm sorry, I just can't take someone seriously who was the "spiritual adviser" to both the late Michael Jackson and con artist spoon-bending Uri Geller, and who has written books on both Kosher Sex and Kosher Jesus. Now that he's got half a billion from casino magnate Sheldon Adelson so he can run for Congress as a Republican - well :Cheeky:

Sheshbazzar · 10-11-2012, 06:39 PM

Boteach is first and foremost a conniving 'politician', a compromising sleazy deal maker that would sell his Jewish heritage, the blood of his forefathers, and his own mother to promote himself. Many Jewish rabbi's see the same.

Shmuley Boteach embracing christianities lies for political gain is now no more a 'Jew', or a representative of Jewish religion than my dog is.

Duvduv · 10-11-2012, 07:05 PM

As an Orthodox Jew I can say I agree 100% with Shesh. Boteach is an utter disgrace to Judaism, and he was even cast out by the Chabad chassidim with whom he was affiliated.
Now I hope we can get back onto topic of the threads of this Forum.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

Boteach is first and foremost a conniving 'politician', a compromising sleazy deal maker that would sell his Jewish heritage, the blood of his forefathers, and his own mother to promote himself. Many Jewish rabbi's see the same.

Shmuley Boteach embracing christianities lies for political gain is now no more a 'Jew', or a representative of Jewish religion than my dog is.

outhouse · 10-11-2012, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApostateAbe

...
I take it you think there isn't a way to tell whether mythicism and atheism have anything to do with each other at this point? Toto thinks the same thing, and I find it an interesting way to think, like maybe you don't trust the pattern that is clearly visible to everyone else if you don't have a scientific poll. Then again, not even a scientific poll is enough to prove the existence of an atheist movement.

I have given you evidence and rational arguments for why mythicism is not related to atheism or hostility to Christianity. You ran your own (unscientific) poll, and there was no particular connection.

The question is why this is so "clearly visible" to you when it does not exist? I think you need a little background reading in how the brain can fool itself by seeing patterns where there is just random noise. (Hint - Pareidolia)

well christians and othe religious people will not be mythers.

doesnt that only leave some atheist/agnostics that can even choose to be within mythicist???

steve_bnk · 10-11-2012, 07:22 PM

Divine Jesus
The poerson of the NT existed, supernatural and all.

Historical Jesus
A non divine flesh and blood human or humans was/were the basis of the movement and stories. The supernatural being embellishments.

Mythical Jesus
The tales are a complete fabrication the product of someone's imagination.

Therist Chistians can only take the DJ, and especially the ressurection tale. If the resurection is false, Chistianity falls apart.

There are philophical Christians who I have seen identify as non-theist devotees of JC.

Atheist seems to run from weak to strong, but by defintion i'd say atheist can only be HJ or MJ.

I identify as as athesist agnostic. I see no evidence for a deity, but I do not think it can be proven or disproven by argument.

For me it is likely an HJ for reasons stated esewhere in the forum and thread.

Agnosticism in general has a wide scope, so I'd say agnostics in general could believe in any of the choices.

outhouse · 10-11-2012, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Divine Jesus
The poerson of the NT existed, supernatural and all.

is also known as biblical jesus, which you would be correct that atheist wouldnt follow.

No Robots · 10-12-2012, 08:01 AM

So, I suppose that any Jew who espouses views similar to those of Boteach will likewise face a general smear-job. This includes people like Jacob Neusner, Joseph Klausner, Martin Buber and Leo Baeck.

No Robots · 10-12-2012, 08:05 AM

And this discussion is within the ambit of the op: The most striking mythicist claim is that Christ is not a Jew.

Toto · 10-12-2012, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by No Robots

So, I suppose that any Jew who espouses views similar to those of Boteach will likewise face a general smear-job. This includes people like Jacob Neusner, Joseph Klausner, Martin Buber and Leo Baeck.

Boteach's views about Jesus are not the issue.

No Robots · 10-12-2012, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Boteach's views about Jesus are not the issue.

They are so. It is you who have refused to comment on those views, and instead offered up nothing but filthy character assassination.

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10-11-2012, 06:39 PM	#72
Sheshbazzar Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: On the path of knowledge Posts: 8,889	Boteach is first and foremost a conniving 'politician', a compromising sleazy deal maker that would sell his Jewish heritage, the blood of his forefathers, and his own mother to promote himself. Many Jewish rabbi's see the same. Shmuley Boteach embracing christianities lies for political gain is now no more a 'Jew', or a representative of Jewish religion than my dog is.

10-11-2012, 07:22 PM	#75
steve_bnk Contributor Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,602	Divine Jesus The poerson of the NT existed, supernatural and all. Historical Jesus A non divine flesh and blood human or humans was/were the basis of the movement and stories. The supernatural being embellishments. Mythical Jesus The tales are a complete fabrication the product of someone's imagination. Therist Chistians can only take the DJ, and especially the ressurection tale. If the resurection is false, Chistianity falls apart. There are philophical Christians who I have seen identify as non-theist devotees of JC. Atheist seems to run from weak to strong, but by defintion i'd say atheist can only be HJ or MJ. I identify as as athesist agnostic. I see no evidence for a deity, but I do not think it can be proven or disproven by argument. For me it is likely an HJ for reasons stated esewhere in the forum and thread. Agnosticism in general has a wide scope, so I'd say agnostics in general could believe in any of the choices.

10-12-2012, 08:01 AM	#77
No Robots Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Edmonton Posts: 5,679	So, I suppose that any Jew who espouses views similar to those of Boteach will likewise face a general smear-job. This includes people like Jacob Neusner, Joseph Klausner, Martin Buber and Leo Baeck.

10-12-2012, 08:05 AM	#78
No Robots Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Edmonton Posts: 5,679	And this discussion is within the ambit of the op: The most striking mythicist claim is that Christ is not a Jew.

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