MissJaymeKat

Hmmmm.... My 2 cents probably isn't worth much, since I'm just a lay person, but I think the picture looks more like a gorilla than a chimp. So what if their diet is more like a chimps than a gorillas? I would think that both chimps and gorillas would be able to vary their diets some, sort of the way humans do. Some humans eat mostly fish in places where it's so cold most of the year that they don't have much of a growing season, while other humans eat more fruits & veggies, red meat, or are even vegetarian, but yet having different diets doesn't make us different species. Do we know that you can't take the average chimp or gorilla and change its diet a bit? If Koko can eat "Gorilla Sundaes", I don't see why a small population of gorillas couldn't eat a more chimp-like diet.

I also never would have thought that a chimp and a gorilla could hook up and make little baby chimpillas. If they mated would anything even happen? They're so very different. I know they're closer to each other than Alexander and Beucephalus, but I still never thought they could cross breed, even if any of them were that pervy.

My humble opinion is that they're some type of gorilla that may have evolved a bit from the others because they are a small isolated population and would, therefore, possibly had some more mutations, and also may have adapted to their wetter environment. For some reason, I can't get past the gorilla looking face and think that they are a type of chimp. If a group of chimps evolved differently than the rest of the chimps in the world, what are the chances that their faces would look so much like gorillas faces, instead of looking different, yet still chimp-like? (I don't know. Like I said, I'm no expert on the subject. Just curious as all get-out.)

It would be very exciting for them to be another group of the ones Biff mentioned.

Anyway, thanks for posting this thread. It's very interesting!

Biff the unclean

That's a photo of a mountain gorilla (note how fuzzy the baby is) the caption is misleading

Azathoth

No, I'm afraid this is not the ape I ordered. It's stringy and quite overdone. Please take it back, and bring me the one I requested.


It should be interesting to see what comes of this. Who knows, maybe they've actually found something.

Even if not likely, it would be nice to see it happen.

liamo

There's a photo of one of these apes on the National Geographic website:

Elusive African Apes: Giant Chimps or New Species?

justsumner

If we consider that:
Chimps are closer genetically to humans than to Gorillas and no one has yet produced a Homo-Chimp Hybrid (North of Texas anyway). It is unlikely that there is some cross bred giant chimp. The more likly answer is either a fake, which is more likly or a new species of Chimp, bring the total to 4 (Bonobo, Pan, Bush, new Giant Chimp)

But..I will check with evolutionary biologist friend in UK concerning this and see what he says.

justsumner

If you mean are they AAT? Nope. According to the theory these buggers are too damned hairy!

Heurismus

If the poor creatures don't end up as 'bushmeat' that is.

I'm intrigued as to their reputed belligerence however. I have never heard of a gorilla actively attacking large lions. Anyone know what the likelihood of this could be?

Perhaps these rare 'gorillas' are more aggressive than their more widely known cousins, but I would suspect that environment has a greater influence than any evolutionary differences. Apart from my hypothetical premise, what are your thoughts on the nature of these 'new' gorillas from what scanty observations there have been?

Biff the unclean

There were several "Boy's own adventure" dime novels published in the 1880's and 90's that tell of gorillas doing that. And carrying off white women. Barnum & Bailey published a book back then called The Wild Beasts, Birds and Reptiles of the World: The Story of Their Capture that's filled with stories like that.

The likelihood of it being true is close to nil.

I hear they are remaking King Kong again. With a CG Kong played by the Golem guy from Lord of the Rings

Clivedurdle

New Scientist 8 October gives I think conclusive evidence it does exist.

Isn't this because Darwin had created the most amazing post based internet? He was in correspondence with just about everyone around the world with interests in evolution and acted in many ways as a collection point for information.

It was possible to communicate before this internet!!

Kuu

According to the New Scientist artlicle the only scientist to have seen them is primatologist Shelly Williams who is currently writing up her research for submission to the International Journal of Primotology. She has suggested 3 possibilities to explain the animals

a) A new species of great ape
b) A gorilla-chimp hybrid
c) a new subspecies of common chimp

One argument against them being gorilla-chimp hybrids is that gorillas have not been seen in the area.

Most scientists are favouring the idea that they are very large chimps for several reasons

a) Their behaviour when confronted is more chimplike than gorilla-like
b) Their diet is rich in fruit which is typical of chimps
c) Mitrochronical DNA taken from hair found in nests suggests that they are chimps.

However they are much larger than any known chimp. Their footprints are longer than both chimps and gorillas. They build nests both on the ground (like gorillas) and in trees (like chimps). It has been suggested that because they are so large the males are confident enough to build nests on the ground, while the females and young have nest in trees.