spin

Oh, foolish christian, You steal a book from another religion and pretend you can understand it with your eyes wide shut.



Are you still content to show that you are unable to understand the issue? Apparently so.

You can be nowhere on any continent.


spin

aChristian

?[/QUOTE]
The prophecy does not start from the command to build the temple, but from the command to rebuild Jerusalem. That happened under Artaxerxes by Nehemiah on March 14, 445 BC. (Neh 2:1-8) If you add the days you arrive at April 6, 32 AD, Palm Sunday.

aChristian

Oh, I understand it. You just won't admit your mistake.

aChristian

On topic, you just don't understand that that is exactly what the prophecy is referring to.

spin

You're another one of these bright sparks who thinks that the Jews returning to Jerusalem lived in the ruins. You're also confusing the wall of Jerusalem with the city. Yup, same gormless crap that I indicated would be argued here.

Elsewhere I wrote:

But then let's look at Isa 45:13, where god says of Cyrus, "he shall build my city and set my exiles free." And Isa 44:28, in which god mentions Cyrus in the context of rebuilding Jerusalem. It's obvious that Cyrus's decree allowed for the building of Jerusalem along with the temple.

But it's the same mentality. 470 years must be about Jesus because we want it to be about Jesus, so let's make it be about Jesus. And as I said here they "will probably point us to Nehemiah, who according to the text of that name, heard that the city wall was broken down, Neh 1:3. Nehemiah then asks Artaxerxes to be sent to Jerusalem so that he could rebuild it (Jerusalem), 2:5b. So the Persian king sent him with a letter permitting him to get materials to build gates and a wall of the city and a house that Nehemiah could occupy, 2:8."


spin

spin

I call your honesty into question.



See the end of this.


spin

spin

If you want to talk about 2 Thes open a thread to do so. It has nothing directly to do with Daniel. I know this is difficult for you to understand because you are in the wrong forum. This is biblical criticism and history, not rampant apologetics.


spin

aChristian

You ought to read the Bible a little more closely.

And it came to pass in the month Nisan, in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes the king, [that] wine [was] before him: and I took up the wine, and gave [it] unto the king. Now I had not been [beforetime] sad in his presence.


Neh 2:2 Wherefore the king said unto me, Why [is] thy countenance sad, seeing thou [art] not sick? this [is] nothing [else] but sorrow of heart. Then I was very sore afraid,


Neh 2:3 And said unto the king, Let the king live for ever: why should not my countenance be sad, when the city, the place of my fathers' sepulchres, [lieth] waste, and the gates thereof are consumed with fire?


Neh 2:4 Then the king said unto me, For what dost thou make request? So I prayed to the God of heaven.


Neh 2:5 And I said unto the king, If it please the king, and if thy servant have found favour in thy sight, that thou wouldest send me unto Judah, unto the city of my fathers' sepulchres, that I may build it.

Your characterization of Nehemiah's task is hardly representative of the facts as we read them throughout Nehemiah, including my quote above. They may even have started to rebuild when they went back under Cyrus, but it was obviously in sad shape in Nehemiah's time. In any case, Cyrus' command was not to rebuild the city if you read it at the end of Chronicles, whereas Artaxerxes command was giving Nehemiah permission to rebuild Jerusalem.

aChristian

You said there,

"As I pointed out there are too few examples (all in Daniel) to give a hard and fast definition. "

However the whole point is that you claim a hard and fast definition exists, yours. And you say (hard and fast) that the BDB and several translations are wrong when they translate it received.

spin

Let's omit the best part:

Then the king said to me, the queen sitting beside him, “How long will your journey be, and when will you return?” So it pleased the king to send me, and I gave him a definite time. 7 And I said to the king, “If it please the king, let letters be given me for the governors of the provinces beyond the River, that they may allow me to pass through until I come to Judah, 8 and a letter to Asaph the keeper of the king’s forest, that he may give me timber to make beams for the gates of the fortress which is by the temple, for the wall of the city and for the house to which I will go.”

A wall and a house for Nehemiah.

You apparently have a different Nehemiah than the one in the bible.

That's irrelevant to Cyrus proclamation. Isaiah knows about it. You want to ignore it.

Yes, build a temple for no people. This is just pedantry. The building of the temple meant the construction of the city. Let's build a temple among the ruins. Yeah, sure. But you want to fake another "prophecy".

Of course your silly fudge doesn't explain the text at all. Seven weeks of years after the proclamation will be the time of the messiah prince [H:M$YX NGYD]. However, you seem oblivious to this, wanting to make the 470th year the death of Jesus. Who was the messiah prince who came after seven weeks of years after the proclamation? Who was the prince whose soldiers come when the messiah is cut off in the same year? Who does the prince make a covenant with for seven years? When is the daily sacrifice stopped for only 3 1/2 years?

In reality all this last week of years is clear:
172/1 Onias III (the anointed one) is killed
Menelaus and his supporters are given control of Jerusalem by Antiochus
167 Antiochus starts his persecution, stopping sacrifices and setting up the abominations.
164 the temple is rededicated and Antiochus dies.

There was no proclamation. Artaxerxes simply gives his permission and gets some letters written. Nehemiah builds a wall, not the city.


spin