seebs

Well, browse this board for a while, looking for anger, contempt, or hatred directed at religion. You see people say things like "one more reason I despise religion" or "one more reason to hate God, if there is one".

Not all atheists think things like that, but some do... And it's human nature to look at the worst of your opponent, not the best. (Who says we have to be opponents? I dunno, but a lot of people on both sides seem to be unwilling to let the idea go.)

winstonjen

I see your point, but I personally don't hate religious people (unless they do things like the Inquisitions) - I hate their religion.

Fundies, OTOH, seem to hate atheists as people simply because of what they believe.

I'm not trying to mock him, but to try and correct him.

livius drusus

I am deeply suspicious of your intentions winstonjen given your history of Magus-jabbing, the most recent instance of which got an E/C thread which began as a positive and interesting discussion locked. You've made your title and OP just general enough to remain on this side of open, but I think this thread, like all its little brothers and sisters, sucks.

Even in the best case scenario, you are using something he wrote seeking fellowship and support as a springboard for your "correction" of him. Just in case it isn't palpably obvious, it won't work.

So have your discussion on stereotypes of atheists, but I suggest you make every effort to keep the discussion general because if I get a whiff of baiting or personal attack just a tad stronger than the one that's already tickling my nostrils, this thread is over.

Thank you,
livius drusus
Moderator, GRD

Gothic_J

I wonder what links rr has regarding us.

and, regarding magus -shrugs- he's posting on a public board regarding us. I see little trouble commenting on it. that said, I wouldnt want this to become a bash thread - he's trying to do what he thinks is right, even tho most of us thing it's silly.

Asha'man

Here is my take on this: Christianity is all about emotional manipulation.

It discourages rational and logical thought, and pushes people's emotional buttons. They are taught to love this, to hate that, to fear this, to want that. It doesn't matter what you see evidence of, you just have to be brainwashed into believing the story.

One of the classic ways to manipulate a population is to manufacture an enemy, and direct anger and hatred towards that enemy. This is exactly the technique used by Hitler against the Jews, and the same technique used by Stalin, Mao, etc. It is a proven technique, used by political leaders throughout history. We even see it to a lesser extent in American politics, with the Democrats blaming all our evils on the Republicans, and visa-versa. It doesn�t matter what reality is, or what the evidence is, to manipulate people, you must demonize the opposition.

It should come as no surprise, therefore, that Christians are programmed to hate atheists. We are the perfect target for them. Their preachers repeat the same mantra in weekly brainwashing sessions: belief is good, disbelievers are evil. They have no choice but to hate us, it�s part of the programming.


Sorry to address the topic, now back to your rants

Haran

FYI: To a theist, you just did a pretty good job of "demonizing the enemy" with that last "brainwashed" post.

When Magus55 first appeared on the boards I sent him an email to be careful here if he made the choice to stay. There are a lot of hateful and hurtful statements directed toward Christians and theists here. Much of it is emotional drivel meant to poke back at theism/Christianity for some reason (most likely, from my experiences, because someone who presented themselves to be a theist or Christian wronged the atheist in some way in the past).

I think Magus is just extremely frustrated (it's not hard to get that way when you feel like the lone ranger against a sea of people who seem angry at your way of life, constantly taunting you...and even poking fun at your sincere and deeply held beliefs).

Magus55 might be having some doubts about his biblical literalism, but that is a normal thing. I feel sad because, from examining people I have known, biblical literalism has the potential of producing a violent emotional swing to militant atheism (a sort of fundamentalism in its own right) and that is not good even for atheists. I dearly hope and pray that the teasing and accusations of hatred, etc. against him do not drive him in that direction.

Belief in the Bible does not have to be completely literal. And in my examinations of the various and sundry atheistic world views, I have not found any brand of atheism to be a better alternative morally, emotionally, socially, or otherwise.

brighid

I am going to agree with seebs. There are plenty examples of atheist/non-theists taking pot shots at theists, not just theism it self. Unfortunately, and imho, I think that simply reinforces the stereotypes so many of us try to fight against. I liken it to the real life gang-banger living in the ghetto lending credence to the stereotypes that blacks are this or that. People tend to focus on what reinforces their own belief system, failing to recognize that doing so is no different then what other people do. It certainly isn't any better because the position may be the correct position to take.

I also think theists, Christian or otherwise, have these notions because they don't know many atheists and have been misinformed (by the hatemongers) about the nature of atheism and its relationship to morality. We must also recognize that the vast majority of theists have had a lifetime of indoctrination and reinforcement of belief. It takes time, patience, and respect to overcome those deeply ingrained notions that atheists are this or that. It certainly doesn't help to disspell those notions when some atheists act like pompous jerks, disrespectful cretins or angry theist bashers now does it?

Fortunately, those people are few ... unfortunately, they are the ones that garner the most attention and will stand out as examples in the minds of theists.

If we don't want theists, who have already been sorely misinformed about who and what we are, it would be prudent not to act in stereotypical manners. It would be prudent to extend the kind of respect we wish to command. That is a difficult task to undertake, and although it might not be immediately effective on a particularly misinformed (or eve rabid) theist, it is the right thing to do and in my experience proves to be effective with that theist and with others simply lurking about. After all, rationality, logic, evolution, etc. stand upon strong, factual evidence (even if some refuse to see it.) The truth is what it is.

Brighid

Rusting Car Bumper

Agreed. In fact I oppose those comments and points of view you quoted. I think they are damaging to us, and they are damaging to the speaker as well.

DC

TomboyMom

Magus55 decided to come into an atheist space and post his unsubstantiated dogmatic assertions. Then he runs back to Rapture Ready (!?!) to whine because he doesn't appreciate the response he gets? He doesn't seem to get it that this space was created to give freethinkers and atheists a safe place to exchange ideas. If Magus55 doesn't like those ideas, he should not come here.

Rene

livius drusus

Amen, sister. Not only is it a good tactical maneuver to display a keen understanding of the Golden Rule and its humanistic grounding outside of any one religion, but I find discussions that hinge on this premise far more interesting. Frothing anger may be understandable, but its stubborn immutability and constant use of well-worn responses to equally well-worn claims make for stultifyingly boring conversations.