Freethought & Rationalism Archive

breathilizer · 03-20-2004, 11:45 AM

What's the point of Jesus?

DBT · 03-20-2004, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by breathilizer
What's the point of Jesus?

So that God the father can feel all warm and fuzzy again.
The blood sacrifice that he requires to feel good has been done.

captainpabst · 03-20-2004, 08:42 PM

The blood of Jesus replaces the blood of the passover lamb in the OT. Jesus' death was interpreted in this manner by early Christians. In the tradition of Jewish Midrash, this symbolism/allegory made sense. Today it is non-sensical.

Magus55 · 03-20-2004, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by breathilizer
What's the point of Jesus?

Um to pay the debt for your sin?

captainpabst · 03-20-2004, 09:42 PM

Magus, maybe you'd care to take a stab at this question. Why does God (Jesus) have to effectively commit suicide in order to pay a debt to himself, owed him by his own creation for falling into a trap that He created? This Christian salvation mechanism is simply non-functional, it seems to me.

Furyus George · 03-20-2004, 10:41 PM

"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the Lord. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts higher than your thoughts."

Isaiah 55:8

Furyus George, taking a stab

Mentalepsy · 03-20-2004, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Um to pay the debt for your sin?

How can God repay a debt that is owed to him by somebody else?

Why is the debt only paid if you believe without evidence that it was?

Why does God not care who is punished, so long as someone is punished?

If a human commits even the smallest sin, he is sent to hell for eternity. If Jesus paid the debt for all of everyone's sins, why didn't he go to hell for eternity?

Soul Invictus · 03-20-2004, 10:57 PM

[edit: off topic deleted.. user notified via PM -Krosis GRD mod]

Furyus George · 03-20-2004, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mentalepsy
How can God repay a debt to himself?

Have you never forgiven a debt owed you by a friend or family member?

Why is the debt only paid if you believe without evidence that it was?

Think, though. Doesn't that give it the ring of truth to you? God wants friends. If it was so obvious (and in a lot of ways, it is) we would accept just to save our own arse (which in a lot of ways, we do) rather than really wanting forgiveness.

Why does God not care who is punished so long as someone is punished?

He demands justice. And He does care who is punished. Only Jesus Christ could pay our debts; no one else would meet the criteria.

If a human commits even the smallest sin, he is sent to hell for eternity. If Jesus paid the debt for all of everyone's sins, why didn't he go to hell for eternity?

The wages of sin is death, spiritual death or separation from God. Hell for eternity is the result of this death. So you see, the separation is the punishment. How the Lord cleared His books in three days I can't explain, but will be glad to get back to you on it.

Furyus George, off to bed

winstonjen · 03-21-2004, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mentalepsy
If a human commits even the smallest sin, he is sent to hell for eternity. If Jesus paid the debt for all of everyone's sins, why didn't he go to hell for eternity?

Better yet, why didn't he clone himself to send all the souls in hell to heaven?

03-20-2004, 11:45 AM	#1
breathilizer Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 3,090	If we have sin no matter what... What's the point of Jesus?

03-20-2004, 10:57 PM	#8
Soul Invictus Contributor Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 15,576	Re: Re: If we have sin no matter what... [edit: off topic deleted.. user notified via PM -Krosis GRD mod]

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03-20-2004, 08:42 PM	#3
captainpabst Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 200	The blood of Jesus replaces the blood of the passover lamb in the OT. Jesus' death was interpreted in this manner by early Christians. In the tradition of Jewish Midrash, this symbolism/allegory made sense. Today it is non-sensical.

03-20-2004, 09:42 PM	#5
captainpabst Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 200	Magus, maybe you'd care to take a stab at this question. Why does God (Jesus) have to effectively commit suicide in order to pay a debt to himself, owed him by his own creation for falling into a trap that He created? This Christian salvation mechanism is simply non-functional, it seems to me.

03-20-2004, 10:41 PM	#6
Furyus George Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Virginia USA Posts: 310	"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the Lord. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts higher than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8 Furyus George, taking a stab

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