Shven

I'd say polytheistic duotheists personally

orac

It's simply shocking the way people will try to work out what's actually real. To hell with knowing the truth! Don't you dare try to take my lies and deception away from me!

Btw, I believe you're wrong, and unless you're prepared to place that belief under scrutiny then you have to admit that I'm right.

Shven

Oh well, at least he's honest about the security-blanket-like nature of his beliefs. Personally I agree with you but hey.

Eireann

That would work for those who consider the God and Goddess to be seperate and distinct entities. I suppose it depends on what you mean by "duotheist." Do you mean a believer in two deities, or a believer in a sort of dichromatic deity, as it were?

Shven

As I dont know what dichromatic means, I'll go for the 2nd one.

I would say that it is very difficult to be a monotheistic Wiccan - what with the ethos and yearly cycle being based around the God and Goddess fucking and all.

Incitatus

The pre-patriachal religions were based around a trinity of deities, two goddesses and a god. Why has the second goddess been dumped? Or is Wicca not related to them?


By the way, this is interesting:

Wicca and the insult to religion

badger3k

Funny, I know quite a few Wiccans and neo-pagans in their 30s, and all are sincere in their beliefs. That's two strikes right there. I also know one who was brought up in his tradition which carries to at least his grandmother, so there are those who are brought up in the religion. Three strikes? I think "inadequacy" might be a better name for the site (or at least this article). Still, I can imagine where the author is coming from when they see an "insult to religion" (I'm guessing their idea of "religion" would insult a whole lot of people). I'd also disagree that buddhism has no practical demands on its adherants, although they seem to believe that laundry lists of do's and don'ts are the key to good behavior. I've found Buddhist ethics and practices more demanding than the Christian taboos.

I did find this rather illustrative of the petty and rather bizarre ideas of the author:
Funny, I find the idea of someone going to hell because they fail to give the proper code words (or donations to the Church or whatever) rather intellectually flabby. A moral code that demands its adherants to think for themselves seems harder than one that demands you to be a sheep and follow the herd. To be fair, not everyone does that, but that doesn't mean it is wrong, sinful, morally bankrupt, or what have you. Edit - the biggest thing seems to be that the author is pigeonholed into one idea of what a religion is, and probably has problems with anything non-Judeo-Christian in origin. I wonder how he'd (she'd/they'd?) handle religious Taoism, or shamanic practices, or other similar religions.

As for the rest, I'll go with Opus - Piffle.

Re the trinity of deities - do you have a source for that? Looking at what I know, the deities in Celtic and Hindu that were "organized" into triads all seem to be the same sex - something along the lines of Brahma, Krishna, Shiva (IIRC - I'm going by memory, and a poor one here). Looking at the Hindu deities, they seem to be organized into pairs (http://saigan.com/heritage/gindex.html). That's one idea that doesn't ring a bell and I'd be interested to learn more.

badger3k

Another look at Wicca and the current trend of popularization: http://www.beliefnet.com/story/160/story_16005_1.html

Incitatus

Allthough I disagree with the Adequacy article's claim that a religion needs to have strict rituals, dogma etc, I agree with the idea that Wicca lacks any genuine depth or profundity. The above post, calling Wicca "a 'new age' model of spirituality-as-personal-fulfillment" is the most honest, and least pretentious, description I've read. It seems extremely unlikey Wicca could produce a person moved by faith to an extent any where near Ghandi or Martin Luther King. However, it's obviously still early days for the religion yet -Christianity must also have existed in a very simple form a mere 50 years after it's creation.

Wicca's relationship to Christianity is worth noting. It's unlikey Wicca would exist with Xtianity to react to. It concentrates on the exact same areas where Xtianity does not do strongly - it's attitudes to women and the environment, acceptance of outside beliefs, for example. Some Wiccans even often identify themselves in terms of their "un-christian-ness." The claims that Wicca is an ancient faith (I realize this is becoming less frequent) is especially ridiculous when considering that Wicca is so much a product of it's time. It espouses liberal and new-age values that have emerged largly since World War II.

I find Wiccans unbelievably touchy, consistently imagining that they're being oppressed (they have this in common with some Christians). Criticising or questioning a Muslim or Christian is acceptable, but to do the same to a Wiccan is to be little better than Hitler. The numerous choleric responses to the original essay (which was created as a joke) is just one of the endless examples of this I've seen.

badger3k

I find depth in belief has little to do with the trappings of the religion - I know many bible thumpers who are extremely shallow while spouting on how good they are. It could be that we have different ideas of what "depth", too. Of course, it could be the people I associate with as well, so YMMV.

Well, some of the values have roots long ago, such as environmentalism. Buddhism and Taoism share that respect or reverence for the environment, as do Shinto, Native American, and other beliefs. Some, though, are more recent developments within society.

Ah, I can agree to a point. When you get exposed to diatribes like this one nearly every day, they seem to be not so humorous. When you have government officials who want to deny you the same rights that others have, it can get personal if you let it. I think the responses are more a symptom of our society rather than an inherent problem with Wiccans (or Christians). Also, the ones who will respond are the ones who are touchy. We'll never hear of the ones who didn't think it worth their time (or whatever their reason is), and with the internet, word spreads around.

My main problem with some criticism of Wicca is the way people come around to it, mainly by assuming that the model of Christianity is the only one for a religion, and make assumptions on others based on that. Other criticisms I have heard are entirely valid and often make good points, and I think criticism is a healthy thing.