FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > Religion (Closed) > Biblical Criticism & History
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Today at 03:12 PM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-02-2012, 09:44 PM   #11
Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: the fringe of the caribbean
Posts: 18,988
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by outhouse View Post
because he was always a roman first and his jewishness has alwys been in question...
Your statement is just a load of BS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by outhouse
why would a jew take his theology to the roman empire if he wasnt already a roman?
Again, more BS. It is claimed Peter the Jew was in Rome and other parts of the Roman Empire.


Quote:
Originally Posted by outhouse
fact is, god-fearers, romans who worshipped judaism but did not convert, is who created christianity
Your statement is WITHOUT Source, and evidence.

Josephus, Suetonius, Tacitus and Cassius Dio CONTRADICT you.
aa5874 is offline  
Old 09-02-2012, 10:36 PM   #12
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
... But in terms of textual and contextual analysis it is worth examining the Saul/Paul contrast especially as it doesn't find a single place in a single epistle, and the question is why not.
Well, go ahead and examine it. What do you conclude?
Toto is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 01:11 AM   #13
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bordeaux France
Posts: 2,796
Default

There is a book written by Hyam Maccoby :
The mythmaker Paul and the invention of christianity.
Huon is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 01:23 AM   #14
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huon View Post
There is a book written by Hyam Maccoby :
The mythmaker Paul and the invention of christianity.
There are some excerpts here, but I don't recall that Maccoby has anything to say about the name change from Saul to Paul.
Toto is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:51 AM   #15
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 4,095
Default

That the stories of Acts were put together as a composite referring to a guy named Saul with other stories that were ascribed to someone named Paul.
It would not be unlike the caes of the Quran, which is a clear composite of different sources having nothing to do with Muhammad (who is only mentioned 4 times in the whole book compared to Moses and Jesus, 136 and 25 respectively).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
... But in terms of textual and contextual analysis it is worth examining the Saul/Paul contrast especially as it doesn't find a single place in a single epistle, and the question is why not.
Well, go ahead and examine it. What do you conclude?
Duvduv is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:33 AM   #16
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
That the stories of Acts were put together as a composite referring to a guy named Saul with other stories that were ascribed to someone named Paul.
...
But the personality of Saul does not change when the name changes to Paul. Why assume that there were any preexisting stories?
Toto is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:36 AM   #17
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 4,095
Default

The stories change. Leading to the sense that one story involved a fellow named Saul, while the other involved a widely travelling preacher named Paul.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
That the stories of Acts were put together as a composite referring to a guy named Saul with other stories that were ascribed to someone named Paul.
...
But the personality of Saul does not change when the name changes to Paul. Why assume that there were any preexisting stories?
Duvduv is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:55 AM   #18
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
The stories change. Leading to the sense that one story involved a fellow named Saul, while the other involved a widely travelling preacher named Paul.
The stories do not change character. Saul starts his travels, Paul continues. There is a consistent narrative, with no indication that there is an actual source for any of the scenes. There is the same vague relationship to the "Pauline" epistles.

:huh:
Toto is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 10:40 AM   #19
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 4,095
Default

But there is still no sensible way to account for a quick transition to Paul without explanation, OR the fact that Acts and the epistles do not inform each other with regard to Paulist doctrines or the Paulist biography.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
The stories change. Leading to the sense that one story involved a fellow named Saul, while the other involved a widely travelling preacher named Paul.
The stories do not change character. Saul starts his travels, Paul continues. There is a consistent narrative, with no indication that there is an actual source for any of the scenes. There is the same vague relationship to the "Pauline" epistles.

:huh:
Duvduv is offline  
Old 09-03-2012, 11:07 AM   #20
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
But there is still no sensible way to account for a quick transition to Paul without explanation, OR the fact that Acts and the epistles do not inform each other with regard to Paulist doctrines or the Paulist biography.
I don't know what you are looking for in the way of "sensible."

The relationship between Acts and the epistles is easy - they were written by competing factions of Christians to counter each other.

Perhaps Robert Price will clarify the matter in his upcoming book on the Colossal Apostle.
Toto is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 11:00 PM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.