schilling.klaus

According to Justin Martyr, Jesus was active in the Torah stories,
indeed responsible for the theophanies of Jewish Scripture,
thus Moses and the patriarchs and prophets actually saw and heard Jesus, not YHWH.

Klaus Schilling

Clivedurdle

I started a discussion here about miscarriages - the medical term is abortion - and ensoulment.

[edited]

There are probably 65million miscarriages annually worldwide. Why would God predetermine that or make hell so big?

Robert Byers

Your right.
All who are conceived but not born go to heaven. so indeed the majority of mankind is saved. Only a minority isn't Though a majority of those burn/pass age of?.
Those born are special and demonstrating a great story of free will and god's extra help.
Rob byers

storytime

You may have forgotten that Jesus was only speaking to the Jews and not the world outside his Judaism. Thus, his statement of "those[Jews] who are well need not a physician." The obedient Jews did not need Jesus to "save" them from their sins, because the righteous Jews were already justified in obedience to their laws.

Jesus saw some as not conforming to laws as required. So his ministry was not to condemn the world, which he was no part of; but to condemn[judge] his own brethren Jews in their sins and departing from their "first love" which was the law given by Moses.

Jesus made the point "I am sent to none but the lost sheep in the house of Israel", sons of Jacob. Jesus was not sent to Rome or Romans, he was not sent to Egyptians, Assyrians, but only sons of Jacob called Israel.

Jesus worshipped his tribal god and no other. Converts were acceptable but only if they conformed to his Judaism, which was his "way, truth and life-style". His God was not a universal God as clearly evidenced by the secular confinement of that god within the 12 tribal names.

The terms of "death" and "hell" was given to emphasis how Jews remaining in their disobedience would be considered as "though they had never been - born", in their being cast out not to have a name in Israel. The point was made in who was a Jew, and who was a liar. "And I will make them come and worship at your feet, who say they are Jews and are not, but liars."

"Sin" (transgression of law) was accounted to Israel[Jews]. The world outside of that Israeli tradition could not "sin" because the world outside had never been given any laws from Moses (who was also called God). "See, I have made thee a god to the people[of Israel])

Are you then a sinner? Am I a sinner? No. The whole world is FREE from the laws of Israel. So it is then, that no one can be cast into hell, or the lake of fire, because these things only had their emphasis in relating condemnation to the sons of Jacob.

Isn't freedom from religion grand?

bornagainathiest

Why do you say this? I'm not familiar with any biblical justification of this statement. Nor am I familiar with any biblical justification of the idea that ensoulment occurs at conception.

About 15% of recognized pregnancies end in miscarriage. The number of unrecognized pregnancies that end in miscarriage is not known, but it would be untrue to say that the MAJORIRTY of mankind (even if mankind is defined as any conceptus) goes to heaven.

Robert Byers

It is common belief that children who die before the age of accountability (before puberty) go to heaven.
As I understand it many conceptions take place that self abort. Not just miscarriage. I think I've read each women who strives for a family over a number of years has 10 or 20 conceptions fail.
i think i've read that and so conclude from that about the majority of mankind.
Robert byers

Joan of Bark

Common belief by who? Based on what?

Dogfish

If it by a christian, then it needs no basis!:Cheeky:

Johnny Skeptic

During the time of Abraham, why didn't God want to reveal his specific existence to anyone who lived far away from Palestine? My question is related to a thread at http://iidb.infidels.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=234265 at the GRD Forum. The title is "Why didn't Christianity start all over the world at the same time?" You made several posts, got into trouble, and then conveniently took the next bus out of town. Your debate mainly at this forum, the GRD Forum, and the Evolution/Creation Forum. Your typical approach is to participate in a thread until you get into trouble, and then conveniently hop over to another thread, or to another forum, until you get into trouble again, and so on. You evasiveness is obvious, and the undecided crowd are not impressed.

Instead of hopping around from thread to thread, and from forum to forum, why don't you take the time to carefully prepare a detailed defense of Christianity and post it at the General Religious Discussions Forum. You will never get anywhere by claiming that the Bible a reliable witness until it has been proven to be an unreliable witness. What you need to state is WHY you
believe that the Bible is a reliable witness. In order to properly answer that question, you will have to post a detailed and comprehensive defense of Christianity. Skeptics at the IIDB will never be influenced by your idle, uncorroborated claims.

bornagainathiest

This common belief (and I agree that it is common among christians) does not have any biblical support. There are no exceptions for children or unborn fetuses.

I'm not sure where you read that, but I read the 15% figure one of my medical texts (The The Core Curriculum: Ultrasound). The number of unrecognized miscarriages can not be known. By definition they occur before the woman knows she is pregnant, if she doesn't know she is pregnant, she doesn't know that she has miscarried. Self-abort, miscarriage, failed first trimester pregnancy, blighted ovum... We can call it anything, but it doesn't alter the basic fact that the number is unknown. I have never seen any estimate (besides yours) that places that number above 50%