Agemegos

Not where I live. Spring starts in September here.

Karalora

I consider Spring to start on February 2nd, making the Equinox the middle of the season rather than the beginning. Makes more sense, don't it? Ditto the other three seasons--I consider them to begin on a date that puts the Solstice or Equinox mid-season.

WCH

@karalora
The problem is that the earth doesn't heat up instantly, and so the amount of light we get from the sun isn't the same as the temperature -- rather, the temperature shift is always a month or two behind the light shift, meaning that winter doesn't really start until after the Winter Solstice.

Karalora

If you're talking about temperature and weather, then the seasons begin at different points for different areas. Where I live, summer conditions prevail well into October. We use astronomical events for the sake of worldwide consistency--why not use them in a way that makes sense?

Also, I would like to add at this point that the ancient Celts celebrated the New Year at the end of October. Like the Jews, they started their day at sunset, at the beginning of the dark period, and they did the same with their year.

WCH

I'm guessing that the "summer" months are still hotter for you than the "fall" months, which are hotter than the "winter" months, even if your fall is probably as hot as my summer, and there is less difference between them, right?

Here it only starts getting cold in December, and the cold lasts for several months before it gets hot again. Why would we call it winter while it's still decently warm out, and spring while everything is frozen and we have 3 feet of snow?

Karalora

I guess it depends on whether you mentally define seasons according to daylight hours, or weather and foliage. If I used the latter, Summer would be six months long and Winter non-existant. I just really really like the symmetry of the Celtic calendar.

It's not as if there is any cultural significance to the changeover points of the seasons the way there is for New Year's Day, so if I draw the lines in different spots than the good people at Hallmark, it doesn't make any practical difference. We all plan our outdoor activities according to what the weather actually is rather than the date on the calendar--if a freak condition results in 95-degree temperatures in January, you can put on your swimsuit and jump in the pool and no one will say boo about it.

Ierrellus

The Herod who massacred babies died in the late Fall, probably from syphilis. This puts Christ's birthdate possibly in October. New Year based on that would be late Oct., early Nov.

MonCapitan2002

I tend to mentally breakl the seasons down according to daylight hours. As someone who prefers wintry weather I would be delighted if an ice age fell upon us.

The Evil One

Unfortunately,

1) the Herod you refer to died ten years or so before Christ's alleged birthdate

2) as has already been pointed out, New Year is not based on Christ's birth or any other Christian event, but is based on the pagan Roman calendar.

Your argument falls down somewhat at this point.

WCH

Uhh... why do you think Jesus was born in the same time of the year as Herod died? Matthew describes the astrologers coming a long distance, which would've taken quite some time, giving Herod a time based on which he killed everyone 2 or under (and therefore Jesus was younger than 2 at the time, but how much younger is unclear), and that Herod died before long after that. What is before long, though? A year? 6 months? 1 day? We have no way of knowing, because the Gospel account doesn't tell us.

@The Evil One
Only if you believe Luke to be inerrant. Fact is that Matthew gives one date and Luke gives another, so it's reasonable for Ierrellus to go based solely on Matthew and ignore Luke, when discussing Herod.