Steven Avery

Basically agree :-) You can see this quite clearly when you look at books about the sabbath history and controversy, such as "From Sabbath to Sunday", or the various books about the Messiahology controversies. There you see the later development of creedal Christianity, where the Athanasian Creed closely represents Catholic orthodoxy, and it, as well as the Cappodocian social trinitarian position, would generally view all early Christians as heretics for their being too Jewish, lacking a "three person in the Godhead" understanding.

Shalom,
Praxeus
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/

Clivedurdle

I am completely confused Yuri and Praexus!

If all the early ones are heretics we do not have the truth now do we?

And to be honest, al this stuff about xian martyrs sounds like a death fetish. Rwanda, the Holocaust and the 20 million Russians who died in WW2 gives a few martyrs an order of magnitude problem.

John A. Broussard

The winner is the one who decides who the heretics are. A few votes in a different direction would have established the Athanasians as heretics.

Heresy is the result of a coin toss.